WolfCat67 wrote:

Dear Scratch Team,


Please, just consider bringing “Discuss” back. I used Inspect Element, fixed it in three seconds (with the link and everything), and took the screenshot. It shouldn't be difficult at all to just add the link inside of the page. Especially considering the fact that it would take up the same amount of space as it used to in the old header, as “Tips” has the same amount of characters as “Help”. Even in other languages, I highly doubt it would be that big of an issue.

Now, about the argument that the Discuss link being removed encourages Create and Explore, as well as becoming a better Scratcher, that's strictly not true. After all, the place was already pretty obscure (now becoming even more obscure), so of course it did not deter a lot of people from creating projects or checking out others. However, even if they did go to the forums, it'd be extremely helpful to anyone needing help. What's better: A page full of tips for Scratchers, or asking for help and getting exact specific answers to help them out from experienced Scratchers? That second place is what the forums can be for almost anyone. You can also advertise, making your projects more popular, ask basic questions, and get ideas for projects.

And no, don't just think “well they can check out the footer”, because that's just not something people do. Trust me, the forums were quite obscure before due to the “Discuss” name not being specific (if it were to come back, just name it “forums”), but now that they're in the footer, nobody will view it except the people who were already here. Nobody new will be trying to join. Believe me, NOBODY checks the footer except for people looking for the wiki, wiki editors checking for references, or people just linking to the Terms of Use or Community Guidelines, which is a small amount of people relative to the vast amount of people on the Scratch website.

Please consider this entire thing. Thanks.

Totally with you there

Forested’s testing :: hat #FF0000
set main colour to [#00BF9A] :: #FF8000
mix colour [#00BF9A] with [#FF9999] :: #FFE300
spend [6 v] tokens on buying [baby snail v] :: #00E300
send [Hugs] to user [RuffilianHoliday v] to [float around the page v] :: #00FFFF
update [2.0 v] to [3.0 v] and [Yay! Scratch three!] :: #0000FF
the world is happy :: #CB00FF

cool

dietbacon wrote:

Hey everyone,

We are always looking for ways to make Scratch easier to get started with. Today we’re excited to announce that we’ve added lots of new resources to a new section called Tips! .



On the new Tips page, you will find interactive tutorials that can help you start making a variety of projects. There are also printable Activity Cards with detailed instructions on how to build any of the projects you are interested in.




In addition to the inclusion of the new Tips page, the site navigation menu has also been updated. We replaced the “Help” button with a “Tips” button, which will lead you to the new Tips page mentioned above. We believe this will help newcomers discover and use our new Scratch activities. We have also removed the “Discuss” button from the navigation menu. We made this decision based on usage (how often it was clicked) and to give emphasis to the other menu options like “Create” and “Explore.” You can still access the Discussion Forums by clicking the link in the footer at the bottom of every page or by going to https://scratch.mit.edu/discuss/. These changes were made to help highlight project creation and get new users started on becoming full fledged Scratchers!

Scratch On!

- - - - -

FAQ:
Where is “Discuss” in the footer?
In the footer, under “Community”, you will see a link to “Discussion Forums”. You can also always access the forums with this url: https://scratch.mit.edu/discuss/

Can you make the search bar smaller to make room for discuss?
This decision was also made in part because the navigation menu is translated to many other languages, and in some of those languages there was just too much text to fit in the space.

The search bar is flexible in size based on the language you are in. While it may appear extra large in English, this is not always the case. For example, change your language to Deutsch and see what happens. And this is with one item removed from the nav bar - imagine what it was like when there were five items in the nav bar before.

How about instead of adding new things, you update the site to make it match like the rest. The old header still shows everywhere except on the home site and search..

dietbacon wrote:

The search bar is flexible in size based on the language you are in. While it may appear extra large in English, this is not always the case. For example, change your language to Deutsch and see what happens. And this is with one item removed from the nav bar - imagine what it was like when there were five items in the nav bar before.

I went on Deutsch and there’s enough room for one more item. Take “About” off instead — nobody ever reads it.

Forested’s testing :: hat #FF0000
set main colour to [#00BF9A] :: #FF8000
mix colour [#00BF9A] with [#FF9999] :: #FFE300
spend [6 v] tokens on buying [baby snail v] :: #00E300
send [Hugs] to user [RuffilianHoliday v] to [float around the page v] :: #00FFFF
update [2.0 v] to [3.0 v] and [Yay! Scratch three!] :: #0000FF
the world is happy :: #CB00FF

-Verso- wrote:

How about instead of adding new things, you update the site to make it match like the rest. The old header still shows everywhere except on the home site and search..

More like removing things…

Oh boy…this change is gonna take awhile to get used to.

i made one this is so cool

I would say this is a great addition to help people learn Scratch!
However, I don't like that “Discuss” is being removed. (And yes, I have read the entire thing about different languages and the footer, etc.)
Sorry.

WolfCat67 wrote:

Dear Scratch Team,


Please, just consider bringing “Discuss” back. I used Inspect Element, fixed it in three seconds (with the link and everything), and took the screenshot. It shouldn't be difficult at all to just add the link inside of the page. Especially considering the fact that it would take up the same amount of space as it used to in the old header, as “Tips” has the same amount of characters as “Help”. Even in other languages, I highly doubt it would be that big of an issue.

Now, about the argument that the Discuss link being removed encourages Create and Explore, as well as becoming a better Scratcher, that's strictly not true. After all, the place was already pretty obscure (now becoming even more obscure), so of course it did not deter a lot of people from creating projects or checking out others. However, even if they did go to the forums, it'd be extremely helpful to anyone needing help. What's better: A page full of tips for Scratchers, or asking for help and getting exact specific answers to help them out from experienced Scratchers? That second place is what the forums can be for almost anyone. You can also advertise, making your projects more popular, ask basic questions, and get ideas for projects.

And no, don't just think “well they can check out the footer”, because that's just not something people do. Trust me, the forums were quite obscure before due to the “Discuss” name not being specific (if it were to come back, just name it “forums”), but now that they're in the footer, nobody will view it except the people who were already here. Nobody new will be trying to join. Believe me, NOBODY checks the footer except for people looking for the wiki, wiki editors checking for references, or people just linking to the Terms of Use or Community Guidelines, which is a small amount of people relative to the vast amount of people on the Scratch website.

And about the reasoning that “It doesn't get enough clicks”, removing it doesn't seem to solve any problems here. You're just taking something that was obscure… And making it more obscure? Why would that be a good idea?

Please consider this entire thing. Thanks.

I for one don't really use the forums anymore but I do agree with this completely.putting the discuss link in the footer of the page is probably not the best idea.as now it will become more obscure than it was before.and the new tips link they added is something that you can already find in the scratch editor (though I think it has more to it but I dunno ) Still though I support this

#BringItBack This update is the worst update since they closed down the TBG's! Anyway, this Tips page is useless; everything on that page is already in the Tips bar in the project editor! It will kill the forums! No New Scratcher is going to look at every link in the footer!

The help button is also missing. Also, that explains a lot.

-Galaxydust- wrote:

The help button is also missing. Also, that explains a lot.

It was replace with the tips button. It's pretty much the same thing.

-Galaxydust- wrote:

The help button is also missing. Also, that explains a lot.

Nvm I get it now.

powercon5 wrote:

-Galaxydust- wrote:

The help button is also missing. Also, that explains a lot.

It was replace with the tips button. It's pretty much the same thing.

What? Help is EXACTLY the same length as Tips, yet Discuss still fit!

I personally think this idea is the most unreasonable thing I've seen the Scratch Team come up with.

How do tips supposed to help new scracthers? I mean it is a good Idea but Is'nt like helping, like a help button???

Hey guys,

I know that some of us are very disappointed that the “Discuss” tab has been removed. I know we are all so used to it being there and how it was a really nice way to get to the forums fast. However, I encourage you to look at it from a New Scratcher's point of view. Scratch's main concepts are to “Imagine, Program, and Share”. The Create tab obviously gives the ‘program’ aspect, Explore the ‘share’, and now with the new Tips tab, there are lot's of resources to help get New Scratcher's accustomed to ‘Imagining’ all that they can do with Scratch. The Discuss tab never really fit into those three central components (except for the Show and Tell forum). No one can argue that the forums aren't a huge part of Scratch and a great resource, but they simply do not fall under the 3 things that the Scratch Team is targeting for New Scratchers to be exposed to. I know it's not ideal, but for the good of hundreds of thousands of children across the world being given the wonderful opportunity to Imagine, Program, and Share, can't we deal with having to scroll to the bottom of the page or clicking the link on the actual Tips page? I promise it won't take long to get used to haha.

Thanks,
St19_Galla

FancyFoxy wrote:

Auroura_Wolf wrote:

Based on the general consensus here, the active forum users were upset by this change. This includes me. It really annoys me, and I think this will confuse lots of people. Also, this may have an effect on the forums in general. Projects advertised in Show and Tell won't get as much attention, confused people may not realize there's a forum to ask their questions, and people may spread the rumor that the forums has shut down
I think it would be better to just bring back the discuss button

Projects in Show and Tell have never really gotten that much attention.

Well even if they used to not get attention, what good is taking the forum off the front page for even less attention? As a result, there may be more spamming in the comment section of projects, which is annoying.

st19_galla wrote:

Hey guys,

I know that some of us are very disappointed that the “Discuss” tab has been removed. I know we are all so used to it being there and how it was a really nice way to get to the forums fast. However, I encourage you to look at it from a New Scratcher's point of view. Scratch's main concepts are to “Imagine, Program, and Share”. The Create tab obviously gives the ‘program’ aspect, Explore the ‘share’, and now with the new Tips tab, there are lot's of resources to help get New Scratcher's accustomed to ‘Imagining’ all that they can do with Scratch. The Discuss tab never really fit into those three central components (except for the Show and Tell forum). No one can argue that the forums aren't a huge part of Scratch and a great resource, but they simply do not fall under the 3 things that the Scratch Team is targeting for New Scratchers to be exposed to. I know it's not ideal, but for the good of hundreds of thousands of children across the world being given the wonderful opportunity to Imagine, Program, and Share, can't we deal with having to scroll to the bottom of the page? I promise it won't take long to get used to haha.

Thanks,
St19_Galla

Just to point out, by the way, we do have a link to the forums in the Tips page. I know it's not nearly as prominent, but it is in a place that are people are more likely to look at in the first place if they want to get help.

Weren't the “tips” easily accessible in the create section? That is a much better place for the tips. I also personally think much more people would use forums instead of tips.