Discuss Scratch

ChiaJia
Scratcher
62 posts

Remixing with no changes...

imfh wrote:

ChiaJia wrote:

I agree, it doesn't seem that there's a “middle ground” between annoying and not-noticeable.
Maybe there should just be an announcement or something by the ST about remixes. That might solve a lot of the problems about no-change remixes.
An announcement might help some in the short term, but it wouldn't work long term. I think that even if a small notice doesn't solve anything, it at least might help.

True, that's something to consider. I still don't fully support the popup idea though.
Maybe make a system for New Scratchers letting them know what a remix is? Maybe a short “what do you know about scratch” quiz? And then, maybe the ST could post an announcement for older Scratchers reminding them what a remix is

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Ultimategamer3000
Scratcher
7 posts

Remixing with no changes...

LegoManiac04 wrote:

No support.
While I think that this is a nice idea, if someone got the “You must make changes before sharing this remix", they could literally make the tiniest, tiniest change, just so it wouldn't count as a copy. I think this could make the original creator unhappy, since it is technically a copy, but has a change that makes it not a copy.


Remember though, if someone did an EXACT copy of your project, you can report it.



I support, it is very important. But I also liked the other idea of saying “you must make changes before sharing this project” and also the tiniest tiniest change can still be counted as a copy so you can report it. That is all, have a nice day!

Last edited by Ultimategamer3000 (Jan. 31, 2020 02:59:33)

chrdagos
Scratcher
500+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

Za-Chary wrote:

It really depends on what counts as a change.

For instance, I could add a sound “pop”, and not use it anywhere. That would have to count as a changed remix.

Or I could make a tiny dot in the bottom of the screen. That would have to count as a changed remix.

Or even, what if I click the green flag and the thumbnail goes away, then I save it? Does that count as a changed remix?

I think this must be thought about carefully. An automated system like this actually would help, but it wouldn't necessarily remove all possible offenses. Of course, that is what the report button is for.
how about this:

If any scripts have been changed, then it's a remix.

That could help.
Za-Chary
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

chrdagos wrote:

how about this:

If any scripts have been changed, then it's a remix.

That could help.
That's not completely right, though. There are projects that can be considered valid remixes even if no scripts are changed. For instance, perhaps someone might remix a project by recoloring someone else's art. As long as it is clear that something was changed about the project, it is considered a valid remix.

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WindOctahedron
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

Za-Chary wrote:

chrdagos wrote:

how about this:

If any scripts have been changed, then it's a remix.

That could help.
That's not completely right, though. There are projects that can be considered valid remixes even if no scripts are changed. For instance, perhaps someone might remix a project by recoloring someone else's art. As long as it is clear that something was changed about the project, it is considered a valid remix.
Plus, one can “change scripts” by adding a block not connected to anything, or needlessly broadcasting something, and it won't count as a valid remix.

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chrdagos
Scratcher
500+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

Za-Chary wrote:

chrdagos wrote:

how about this:

If any scripts have been changed, then it's a remix.

That could help.
That's not completely right, though. There are projects that can be considered valid remixes even if no scripts are changed. For instance, perhaps someone might remix a project by recoloring someone else's art. As long as it is clear that something was changed about the project, it is considered a valid remix.
o.k, but I do wonder what the set definition of a remix is, assuming that it's not a “in the eye of the beholder” kind of thing.
chrdagos
Scratcher
500+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

o.k, but I do wonder what the set definition of a remix is, assuming that it's not a “in the eye of the beholder” kind of thing.
I say this because if two scratchers have different ideas on what is and what isn't a remix, then a flame war can start, and all that is needed is for one of them to make a remix of the other scratcher's project.

Last edited by chrdagos (Feb. 1, 2020 16:33:20)

chrdagos
Scratcher
500+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

Bump.
-Iimitless-
Scratcher
100+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

Adding the ability to delete or unshare people's remixes would only cause problems. I think a pop-up is much more reasonable.

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Ultimategamer3000
Scratcher
7 posts

Remixing with no changes...

imfh wrote:

catmonster12 wrote:

What is up with this trend of scratchers changing their profile picture to a bar that moves ???
define 
This?
Please don't post unrelated stuff on random topics. It's called “thread highjacking.” You should instead create a new topic on the Questions about Scratch forum. In fact, if you looked there, you would find that several people have already asked that question and you could just look at the answer they got.

To answer your question, apparently @Brad-Games made some for a couple Scratchers and it made the globes popular enough that more people started getting them. For more information, look at Brad's studio: https://scratch.mit.edu/studios/7287340/

ChiaJia wrote:

imfh wrote:

-snip-
I don't think it would be that annoying. You only have to see it once per remix. It doesn't have to be really big or require clicking an ok button. It could go away automatically, like the cloud warning.

One suggestion I can think of would be to add a “don't show this alert again” option so that people who remix with good intentions can get rid of the popup… But that has it's downsides too: if someone accidentally turns “don't show this alert” on without reading it and still doesn't know what a remix is.

Also, if the popup is small and not-very-noticeable, as you suggested, that also defeats its own purpose. If it is easily overlooked, no one would know it's there and there would be no reason to add it in the first place.
It would be hard to balance between annoying and ineffective. Maybe it could be bigger for the first time, and then smaller for the rest? It's still not perfect as they might not read it the first time.

I agree
-GentooPenguin-
Scratcher
100+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

No support. If no changes have been made to a remix, you can just ‘Report’ the remix.
Maximouse
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

This post was useless.

Last edited by Maximouse (March 30, 2020 18:32:12)



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wedrfvhy2
Scratcher
24 posts

Remixing with no changes...

Yellowsheep43
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

bibleboy789 wrote:

-snip-
Or if not, If scratchers remix projects and are about to share them without changes, There will be a sign or something on-screen that says “You must make changes before sharing this remix.” Thats my suggestion! Thanks.

I had this exact idea, and I was almost going to make a forum post about it. So maximum support.

Although there are some ways to get around this:
-Drag a block from the block select into the project, then back into the block select to delete it
-Add a disconnected block that does basically nothing
-Change the title or description of the project.

Either way, this would definitely solve the problem of remixes with nothing changed.

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Zoomer_X
Scratcher
500+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

Za-Chary wrote:

It really depends on what counts as a change.

For instance, I could add a sound “pop”, and not use it anywhere. That would have to count as a changed remix.

Or I could make a tiny dot in the bottom of the screen. That would have to count as a changed remix.

Or even, what if I click the green flag and the thumbnail goes away, then I save it? Does that count as a changed remix?

I think this must be thought about carefully. An automated system like this actually would help, but it wouldn't necessarily remove all possible offenses. Of course, that is what the report button is for.
No support, because of the reasons above. I think that the report feature has an option for “Exact Copy”

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lm1996
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

bibleboy789 wrote:

Well, it would be great if the person that made the original could delete any remixes of their project.
This would cause an uproar in the community and make many a Scratcher mad.

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No support, as per what everyone is saying.

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IndianRuby718
Scratcher
100+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

lm1996 wrote:

bibleboy789 wrote:

it would be great if the person that made the original could delete any remixes of their project.
This would cause an uproar in the community and make many a Scratcher mad.
True.. instead of that, what if instead of share the button would say “Request Original Creator's Approval” and when they click it and confirm in the window that pops up (since they won't be able to make any changes while waiting for approval), it would send a notification and the original creator would be able to access the project (but not make any changes) and see it's a good remix before approving. Once it's approved the remixer would be notified, and once the notification is read the remix becomes shared.

This could be a problem for popular projects with a lot of remixers though, so maybe it could be an option to have to get approval before sharing a remix. There's a lot of problems with this alternative in general though, like spamming, possible private messaging (but the creator wouldn't be able to respond except in public, nor would the remixer be able to make any changes while waiting for approval), and using it to make sure no one can remix (which is rejected). But the last one also applies the suggestion to be able to delete remixes.

Right now the best option looks like the popup when you hit remix explaining what a remix is. But as mentioned, this could get annoying. So I suggest that this only pops up while you're a New Scratcher, and/or it's your first two or three remixes.

Last edited by IndianRuby718 (Dec. 21, 2020 05:21:19)


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Za-chary wrote:

I get more frustrated with people telling me about “mass reporting” than I do about “mass reporting” itself.
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Maximouse
Scratcher
1000+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

IndianRuby718 wrote:

-snip-
That won't be implemented. The CC BY-SA 2.0 license, which is used for Scratch projects, says everyone can “create and reproduce Derivative Works”, even without approval from the creator. And remixing is an important part of Scratch anyway.


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DaRealCatrina
Scratcher
94 posts

Remixing with no changes...

You guys do realize someone necropsted and this topic is a year old. The OP won't even check this.

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ForumHelperNanoPiex
Scratcher
500+ posts

Remixing with no changes...

My reason I no support has already been said, should I still say it?

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