Ok. Thanks so much for reading this. Firstly, I want to say that this is not, repeat not a confusing way of creating 3D scratch. Now, on with the new block…

I plan for the block to look like this:

 
set [perspective v] effect to (0) with viewpoint at X:(0) Y:(0) :: looks 

All this will do is it will make the part of a sprite closest to the viewpoint largest, and vice versa. This could make an easy background with a slight 3D effect, as in many games.

<["Confusing to new Scratchers"] = [Bad argument]>
as < [Lots of things] are [Confusing to new Scratchers] :: motion>  and < [This idea] is [significantly less complicated than others] :: motion> :: sound

There are many functions, like procedures, mathematical functions, messages, logic, etc. which would be just as confusing…

This could greatly improve my, and many others' projects, such as one of mine: https://scratch.mit.edu/projects/154658871/

Thank you for reading. I hope you will support me, but in the meantime, SCRATCH ON!!

JDScratch7

————————————————–

Oh, Scratch Team, if you're there, please could you give me your format for code for fisheye effect, so I could try and replicate it for perspective? Thanks. No problem if you can't.

Oh, and please tell me what you think. Even if you don't support the idea, tell me what you don't like. Please.

LIST OF SUPPORTERS:
@Digital_Gaming
@Penguin9090_new
@Scratcher1002
@XenoCoding
@Tofugrl14
@CGR248569
@Charles12310
@smilefly
@Auroura_Wolf
@Charles12310
@Carriage

SEMI SUPPORT:
@WolfCat67
@Blaze349
@Sheep_maker
@LionHeart70
@Gabriel2900
@walkcycle

NOt much SUPPORT:
@MathlyCat
@duckboycool
@cul8tor
@ChildCritic

This could be an interesting addition. I don't see how you could work around it with the basic graphical effects.

Blaze349 wrote:

This could be an interesting addition. I don't see how you could work around it with the basic graphical effects.

Thanks for your feedback. I believe this could be similar to the ‘fisheye’ effect block.

Considering I don't even understand this, I wouldn't be making the claim of not confusing to newer Scratchers….

MathlyCat wrote:

Considering I don't even understand this, I wouldn't be making the claim of not confusing to newer Scratchers….

??

Look, all it is basically fisheye effect. However, instead of the centre becoming biggest, the point furthest from the vanishing point does.
It is nowhere near as complicated as a 3D engine would be. Imagine looking at a road. It will get narrower the further you look along. This is the same idea. ‘The vanishing point’ is the place where the road narrows off to. It is where the ‘triangle’ of the road ends.

https://tse4.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.fEnB64-0JbagLGW3yRGdgAEsC7&pid=15.1

Oh, and no offence. ;-)

MathlyCat wrote:

Considering I don't even understand this, I wouldn't be making the claim of not confusing to newer Scratchers….

Actually, thinking about it, this is virtually identical to ‘fisheye’ effect. Give it a try, and experiment with different centres. However, the main difference is that you choose where the road vanishes off to, without having to re-centralise.

Interesting.
Maybe instead of using the effects block, we can combine both functions into one block:

set vanishing point to x: () y: () strength () :: looks

I agree that this would be confusing for new scratchers however, but could be useful.
Support.

Penguin9090_new wrote:

Interesting.
Maybe instead of using the effects block, we can combine both functions into one block:

set vanishing point to x: () y: () strength () :: looks

I agree that this would be confusing for new scratchers however, but could be useful.
Support.

That is actually a really nice idea for the block. Thanks so much.

OK, alright, *maybe it would be a tad confusing to new scratchers, but I personally believe that someone's understanding of 3D doesn't depend on their experience of scratch.

For example, this sounds a bit cocky, but I honestly think I would mostly have understood that block when I had joined scratch (with a bit of experimenting). However you see that @MathlyCat (no offence) doesn't completely understand it even with 1000+ posts!

My point in saying this is that I don't think you can judge scratchers by their experience, e.g. saying that all new scratchers must have a poor understanding of perspective, but experienced scratchers always understand everything.

Have a nice day.

Really sorry @MathlyCat. :(

*EDIT: I should have put, “In perspective”…

How about the block looking like this:

Set perspective effect to () with vanishing point at x: (0) y: (0)

Oh, and by the way, how do you change the colour of a block in text?

JDScratch7 wrote:

Penguin9090_new wrote:

Interesting.
Maybe instead of using the effects block, we can combine both functions into one block:

set vanishing point to x: () y: () strength () :: looks

I agree that this would be confusing for new scratchers however, but could be useful.
Support.

That is actually a really nice idea for the block. Thanks so much.

OK, alright, maybe it would be a tad confusing to new scratchers, but I personally believe that someone's understanding of 3D doesn't depend on their experience of scratch.

For example, this sounds a bit cocky, but I honestly think I would mostly have understood that block when I had joined scratch (with a bit of experimenting). However you see that @MathlyCat (no offence) doesn't completely understand it even with 1000+ posts!

My point in saying this is that I don't think you can judge scratchers by their experience, e.g. saying that all new scratchers must have a poor understanding of perspective, but experienced scratchers always understand everything.

Have a nice day.

Really sorry @MathlyCat. :(

Most (expecting most users aren't alts) new scratchers probably haven't done much with Scratch so they'll definitely see the block as odd and confusing. Though not exactly a reason not to add it, I kind of understand it now, but it's not about 3D rather than shrinking/twisting the costume.

I'm sure you can get some sort of 3D effect by messing around with effect blocks.

MathlyCat wrote:

Most (expecting most users aren't alts) new scratchers probably haven't done much with Scratch so they'll definitely see the block as odd and confusing. Though not exactly a reason not to add it, I kind of understand it now, but it's not about 3D rather than shrinking/twisting the costume.

I'm sure you can get some sort of 3D effect by messing around with effect blocks.

You really can't. To do that, one would need to set the centre of a sprite inside the code, which isn't currently possible. Also, re-centring the sprite would create unnecessary movement and rotation.

Maybe when the block right-clicked, there could be a help page like with other blocks.

Every new change seems to be ‘too complicated for scratch’.
Imagine the person who thought of the idea of:

([acos v] of (9))

Did they really think that new scratchers would understand? (Likewise, this has little to do with scratch experience, as I don't understand it)

Perspective is no less complicated than cos, sin, ln, log, etc.

And, anyway, if someone doesn't know how to use it, then they simply don't use it, or they ask for help.

How would the ST code this? I don't really know if this would be possible to code.

For example, let's say that I just made a new project with only the Scratch cat at 0, 0. What happens if I do

set perspective effect to (10) with vanishing point at x: (0) y: (0)::looks

Does the Scratch cat disappear since all of it is engulfed in the vanishing point? Does it light warp to the center of the costume? What does it do?

What happens if I put the vanishing point on an X position other than 0?

How does it know what to give perspective, and what not to give perspective to?

It would be difficult to implement, I know that for sure, but it would be a good feature if someone would find a way for it to be possible. However, I don't agree with you limiting it to just Scratchers or if they request it; after all, the Cloud Data limit was only implemented to prevent Cloud Data spam from New Scratchers who could just make an account dedicated to spamming with Cloud. This block wouldn't have that issue, and should be kept. After all, there are still blocks in Scratch right now that are confusing to New Scratchers (after all, who actually understood how to use custom blocks and variables with pen to create certain things? Pen seems to be pretty difficult to lots of people anyway, regardless of how new they are).

JDScratch7 wrote:

Ok. Thanks so much for reading this. Firstly, I want to say that this is not, repeat not a confusing way of creating 3D scratch. Now, on with the new block…

I plan for the block to look like this:

 change [perspective v] effect by () 

and to be accompanied a block like this:

 set vanishing point to X:() Y:() 

All this will do is it will make the part of a sprite closest to the vanishing point smallest, and vice versa. This could make an easy background with a slight 3D effect, as in many games.

(removed by moderator - please keep it polite)

Maybe this could be a feature only available to full Scratchers, or only if they request it, etc.

This could greatly improve my, and many others' projects, such as one of mine: https://scratch.mit.edu/projects/154658871/

Thank you for reading. I hope you will support me, but in the meantime, SCRATCH ON!!

JDScratch7

Support. This would allow for 3D affects

Ok! Thanks all for the feedback.

Firstly, @duckboycool, you wouldn't usually place the vanishing point (it is usually near or off the edge of the screen) in the middle of a sprite, but if you did so, it would just make the centre of a sprite slightly smaller. This would be similar to if you had centred the sprite, then changed fisheye effect by -10.

You can see for yourself what the effect would look like by centring the sprite on your wanted vanishing point then setting ‘fisheye’ effect to -10. The problem with this is that it creates unnecessary movement, and the warping is slightly ‘off’.

Next, @WolfCat67. I know what you mean.
However, I believe the ‘Scratch Code’ for ‘fisheye’ effect looks something like this (for each ‘pixel’):
Oh, and by the way, I know this wouldn't be accurate – it's an example

define Change Fisheye effect by (effect)  
Repeat (No. of Pixels)
Change size by ((distance to [centralised point v]) * (effect))
end

This would only need to be modified to (PLEASE READ FOR THE CODE:)

define Set Perspective effect to (strength) with X:(x) Y:(y)  
Repeat (No. of Pixels)
Change size by ((distance to (point at X:(x) Y:(y) )) * (strength))
end

I know the code won't work in a scratch project, but with the programs the ST are using, I'm sure it will be fairly easy – similar to the graphic effects.
More accurate version below:

define Set Perspective effect to (strength) with X:(x) Y:(y)
Set [pixel v] to [1]
Repeat (Total Pixels in [Current Sprite v] ) 
Change size of (pixel) by (((distance to (point at X:(x) Y:(y))) * (strength)) - (strength))
Change [pixel v] by (1)
end

I am unsure on what the ‘pixels’ are and what to call them.

Updated code
—<<<***READ FOR THE CODE!!***>>>—
IF YOU ARE LOOKING FOR THE FINAL (so far) CODE, LOOK NO FURTHER!
THE CODE IS BELOW:

define Set perspective effect to (strength) with viewpoint at X:(x) Y:(y)
Set [pixel v] to [1]
Repeat (Total Pixels in [Current Sprite v]  :: sensing)
Set size of (join [pixel] (pixel)) to ((100) / (((distance to (point at X:(x) Y:(y)::motion)) * ((strength) / (100))) + (1)))::looks
Change [pixel v] by (1)
end

set [perspective v] effect to (0) with viewpoint at X:(0) Y:(0) :: looks

This assumes that each pixel is named pixelx, and that the centre point of each pixel is not on the pixel; it is where it would be if the sprite were to be put together. Think of it like this – imagine you had your chosen sprite. Now imagine duplicating it by an amount equal to the number of pixels in the sprite. For each sprite, you delete everything except the pixel you want. Now the centre will not be on the pixel. Again, this couldn't be done on Scratch, because Scratch automatically re-centralises each sprite if there is no colour outside the main picture. When each pixel is resized, it will also move accordingly, because the blank space also get re-sized.


P.S. Ok, I do admit this is starting to get rather confusing. I think it would be a lot simpler to understand if we could experiment with the block. ;-)

P.P.S. Still no idea what to call the ‘pixels’.

IF YOU ARE STRUGGLING TO UNDERSTAND, THIS EXAMPLE WILL MAY HELP!

Look at this image:
http://sr.photos2.fotosearch.com/bthumb/CSP/CSP992/k14386490.jpg

This doesn't have perspective.
Imagine you are viewing from the bottom of the road (as if you were driving along it). That point (maybe X: (0) Y: (-100) becomes the viewpoint. This means that exactly on the viewpoint, the road is at 100 size. The road then gets ‘smaller’ the further along you go. The strength determines how fast the road gets smaller. If you were driving along the road, the perspective would have a high strength, whereas, if you were a bird looking down from a lamppost, it would have a low strength.S = 10,000 / D where S is the input “Strength” and D is the Distance needed from the viewpoint to make a pixel with 1% size.
THEREFORE, THE DISTANCE NEEDED (from the viewpoint) FOR A PIXEL TO BE AT 1% SIZE IS EQUAL TO THE STRENTH * 10,000. THIS MEANS THAT WITH 100 STRENGTH, A ‘PIXEL’ 100 DISTANCE AWAY WOULD BE AT SIZE 1%.

P.S. STILL no idea what to call the ‘pixels’…

So, it focuses on the coordinates, and fisheyes the rest of the project or just the sprite?

Hmm, support?