Hello everyone, today, as you might know, Scratch has now released a Beta version of the Experimental Song Maker that you can try them on Github in this link:
https://scratchfoundation.github.io/scratch-editor/song-maker2/scratch-gui/
Unfortunately, the link doesn't work anymore, it now redirects you to the 404 error page of Github, so, go to this link, you will be redirected to the (probably) same version that is gotten on Github, though this works partially, some features might not work correctly (?) (shout-out to @Dhdfuhrifi for the link):
https://dhdfuhrifi.github.io/scratch/song-maker-gui

Disclaimer: This feature is an experimental feature made by the Scratch Team for testing purposes. It is not the final product, and is subject to be changed anytime. It could be fully implemented or even scrapped by the team in the future (especially the Generative AI feature in the Song Maker). Let's just wait and see.

Anyway, this is my opinion on it, from the comment that I just made recently:
Wow, let me tell you, this is a crazy feature for Scratch and I think this is probably another Game-Changer for Scratch! This is actually a pretty-impressed feature. It brings a lot of musical features that Scratch never had before. This is more like a proper MIDI Song Maker. These bunch of features are the huge upgrades for composing musics on Scratch!

These are the suggestions that I think these should be implemented and would help everyone on Scratch:
1. More Beginner-friendly:
Some features in the Song Maker, like Effects and the Bar, those are pretty complicated features for the Music beginners or New Scratchers. So, I think the Song Maker should have 2 seperated modes: Beginner Mode (without advanced settings and full edits) and Advanced Mode (entire Song Maker for music composers).
2. Interactive Tutorials:
Add tutorials for beginners to teach them how to create a melody in this Song Editor, so they can understand how to use.
3. Better AI Explanations:
Instead of just saying “Generate A Melody”, you can make AI more interactive for users like “Remix it!” or “Change some notes!”.
4. Optimize Performance:
The important suggestion, this would be good for the people that uses low-end devices. I think a lower-size AI model that runs on smaller RAMs could be better for them. Especially when running the AI model in the browser.
5. AI Generation Controls:
It'd be more editable when generating a song, for examples: Adding some optional settings like Song Length, Effects, Instruments, etc.
6. “AI-Generated” Tag:
It's important to know the melody was created by a Generative AI feature from the Song Maker, so I think the Scratch Team should add an explicit tag to the melody and also the project that has it to let viewers know that this project contains AI-generated melodies.

Anyway, that's it. I hope these would be implemented by the Scratch Team. Thank you for the awesome feature that is planning to be added on Scratch! Keep going forward!

Nice, followed

WPONTA wrote:

Nice, followed

Thank you!

Alright, I just added the 6th suggestion called “”AI-generated“ Tag”. Here we go!

6. “AI-Generated” Tag:
It's important to know the melody was created by AI Song Maker, so I think the Scratch Team should add an explicit tag to the melody and also the project that has it to let viewers know that this project contains AI-generated melodies.

ReallySopa wrote:

6. “AI-Generated” Tag:
It's important to know the melody was created by AI Song Maker, so I think the Scratch Team should add an explicit tag to the melody and also the project that has it to let viewers know that this project contains AI-generated melodies.

It seems that the song maker is an extension (that's how you use the blocks for the song maker). If that is the case, I imagine that the project will have a tag that shows that the song maker was used, just like any other extension.

At the same time, as of writing this, I am now foolishly realizing that someone can totally use the song maker and its blocks without using any of the AI features. In this case the tag would still appear, so I suppose you are suggesting that a tag for AI-generated melodies specifically should show up.

Slightly off-topic, but I feel like we as a community should be careful not to call this song maker the “AI Song Maker.” I'd hate for folks to accuse others of using AI just because they used the song maker. There is a difference between the “Song Maker” and the “AI features that are a part of the Song Maker.”

Za-Chary wrote:

It seems that the song maker is an extension (that's how you use the blocks for the song maker). If that is the case, I imagine that the project will have a tag that shows that the song maker was used, just like any other extension.

At the same time, as of writing this, I am now foolishly realizing that someone can totally use the song maker and its blocks without using any of the AI features. In this case the tag would still appear, so I suppose you are suggesting that a tag for AI-generated melodies specifically should show up.

Slightly off-topic, but I feel like we as a community should be careful not to call this song maker the “AI Song Maker.” I'd hate for folks to accuse others of using AI just because they used the song maker. There is a different between the “Song Maker” and the “AI features that are a part of the Song Maker.”

Well, yeah, exactly, Song Maker is not completely AI, so I think we should say that it is AI feature of the Song Maker instead. You can use the Song Maker without AI, since AI is optional, as algorithmar has said. And yes, I was suggesting to add a tag for the projects that contains melodies that were generated by AI. Thank you for the off-topic part, it helps making it clearer!

Za-Chary wrote:

ReallySopa wrote:

6. “AI-Generated” Tag:
It's important to know the melody was created by AI Song Maker, so I think the Scratch Team should add an explicit tag to the melody and also the project that has it to let viewers know that this project contains AI-generated melodies.

It seems that the song maker is an extension (that's how you use the blocks for the song maker). If that is the case, I imagine that the project will have a tag that shows that the song maker was used, just like any other extension.

At the same time, as of writing this, I am now foolishly realizing that someone can totally use the song maker and its blocks without using any of the AI features. In this case the tag would still appear, so I suppose you are suggesting that a tag for AI-generated melodies specifically should show up.

Slightly off-topic, but I feel like we as a community should be careful not to call this song maker the “AI Song Maker.” I'd hate for folks to accuse others of using AI just because they used the song maker. There is a different between the “Song Maker” and the “AI features that are a part of the Song Maker.”

Yeah, true (bumping)

I support these, especially the 6th one

I agree with all your points here especially regarding AI implementation. I'm incredibly anti gen-AI so I have grievances about the feature anyway but your suggestions really fix some of that. (Sorry about my terrible writing here.)

Although, as a personal, slightly off-topic suggestion, I would much prefer if the AI gave you tips on how to create something instead of doing it for you. Like instead of “create a great bass line from the chord progression”, it could be "how do I create a great bass line from the chord progression", in which case the AI could respond with something like “You could try using a descending motion using notes from the chords, using notes outside the chord on the last one to build suspense i.e. for a typical C-G-Am-F chord progression, you could use C-B-A-G, which uses notes from the first three chords and makes the final chord F(add9), an unresolved chord that wants to head back to C. Blend these techniques with funky rhythms, extra notes, and flourishes to create a memorable bassline.” Edit: Bear in mind I am still learning music theory so this advice may be dodgy.

Mozboz wrote:

“You could try using a descending motion using notes from the chords, using notes outside the chord on the last one to build suspense i.e. for a typical C-G-Am-F chord progression, you could use C-B-A-G, which uses notes from the first three chords and makes the final chord F(add9), an unresolved chord that wants to head back to C. Blend these techniques with funky rhythms, extra notes, and flourishes to create a memorable bassline.” Edit: Bear in mind I am still learning music theory so this advice may be dodgy.

Cool music theory explanation, but would this be understandable for folks who don't know music theory? I'm not sure if everyone knows what a C-G-Am-F chord progression is, what F(add9) means, or how to “Blend these techniques with funky rhythms, extra notes, and flourishes.”

Mozboz wrote:

Although, as a personal, slightly off-topic suggestion, I would much prefer if the AI gave you tips on how to create something instead of doing it for you. Like instead of “create a great bass line from the chord progression”, it could be "how do I create a great bass line from the chord progression", in which case the AI could respond with something like “You could try using a descending motion using notes from the chords, using notes outside the chord on the last one to build suspense i.e. for a typical C-G-Am-F chord progression, you could use C-B-A-G, which uses notes from the first three chords and makes the final chord F(add9), an unresolved chord that wants to head back to C. Blend these techniques with funky rhythms, extra notes, and flourishes to create a memorable bassline.” Edit: Bear in mind I am still learning music theory so this advice may be dodgy.

That's a good idea you got here, this makes the users use AI actually explore and be more “creative” on using AI. And AI won't be a “Can you solve this homework?” assistant on Scratch!

Za-Chary wrote:

Mozboz wrote:

“You could try using a descending motion using notes from the chords, using notes outside the chord on the last one to build suspense i.e. for a typical C-G-Am-F chord progression, you could use C-B-A-G, which uses notes from the first three chords and makes the final chord F(add9), an unresolved chord that wants to head back to C. Blend these techniques with funky rhythms, extra notes, and flourishes to create a memorable bassline.” Edit: Bear in mind I am still learning music theory so this advice may be dodgy.

Cool music theory explanation, but would this be understandable for folks who don't know music theory? I'm not sure if everyone knows what a C-G-Am-F chord progression is, what F(add9) means, or how to “Blend these techniques with funky rhythms, extra notes, and flourishes.”

I'm afraid that there are a lot of people who don't really understand Music Theory very much like me. So that's why we need tutorials on how to actually use the Song Maker. The AI should be a “teacher” for the Music Theory beginners! And I suggested for it. I think if the Song Maker is actually an Up-Coming feature (the feature is still experimental anyway), then they will create some tutorials about how to use the Song Maker on Scratch.

Anyway, I just added a disclaimer in the OP to make sure that everyone knows the feature isn't an Up-Coming feature, it's still an experimental feature.

ReallySopa wrote:

Disclaimer: This feature is an experimental feature made by the Scratch Team for testing purposes. It is not the final product, and is subject to be changed anytime. It could be fully implemented or even scrapped by the team in the future (especially the Generative AI feature in the Song Maker). Let's just wait and see.

bump

bump

Mozboz wrote:

“You could try using a descending motion using notes from the chords, using notes outside the chord on the last one to build suspense i.e. for a typical C-G-Am-F chord progression, you could use C-B-A-G, which uses notes from the first three chords and makes the final chord F(add9), an unresolved chord that wants to head back to C. Blend these techniques with funky rhythms, extra notes, and flourishes to create a memorable bassline.”

What the what?

ReallySopa wrote:

Hello everyone, today, as you might know, Scratch has now released a Beta version of the Experimental Song Maker that you can try them on Github in this link:
https://scratchfoundation.github.io/scratch-editor/song-maker2/scratch-gui/
-snip-

*cough* this looks a lot like what google gemini would make *cough*

inklinkid wrote:

ReallySopa wrote:

Hello everyone, today, as you might know, Scratch has now released a Beta version of the Experimental Song Maker that you can try them on Github in this link:
https://scratchfoundation.github.io/scratch-editor/song-maker2/scratch-gui/
-snip-

*cough* this looks a lot like what google gemini would make *cough*

A lot of it was actually made by Claude

gem1001 wrote:

inklinkid wrote:

ReallySopa wrote:

Hello everyone, today, as you might know, Scratch has now released a Beta version of the Experimental Song Maker that you can try them on Github in this link:
https://scratchfoundation.github.io/scratch-editor/song-maker2/scratch-gui/
-snip-

*cough* this looks a lot like what google gemini would make *cough*

A lot of it was actually made by Claude

But minus the thing being made by AI, does it work good? And if it was made without AI, would you like it? The whole purpose of the prototype is for people to see how they like the interface and setup, not to argue about the code (that nobody will ever see or need to use.)

blackcow29 wrote:

But minus the thing being made by AI, does it work good? And if it was made without AI, would you like it? The whole purpose of the prototype is for people to see how they like the interface and setup, not to argue about the code (that nobody will ever see or need to use.)

Before I knew about the whole AI thing, I felt that the way it was set up clashed with the way the Scratch editor currently works. You can't backpack music tracks or export them, and it requires a lot of code to play a specific song, unlike the sound blocks, which you can play with just one block. I proposed a solution to the latter problem here.

Za-Chary wrote:

Mozboz wrote:

“You could try using a descending motion using notes from the chords, using notes outside the chord on the last one to build suspense i.e. for a typical C-G-Am-F chord progression, you could use C-B-A-G, which uses notes from the first three chords and makes the final chord F(add9), an unresolved chord that wants to head back to C. Blend these techniques with funky rhythms, extra notes, and flourishes to create a memorable bassline.” Edit: Bear in mind I am still learning music theory so this advice may be dodgy.

Cool music theory explanation, but would this be understandable for folks who don't know music theory? I'm not sure if everyone knows what a C-G-Am-F chord progression is, what F(add9) means, or how to “Blend these techniques with funky rhythms, extra notes, and flourishes.”

Yeah, that's fair. I just typed it like that since I needed a decently long response and couldn't think of any filler.