Could we please have an exponents block? ( ) ^ ( )

ProdigyZeta7

ErnieParke wrote:

([10 ^ v] of ((power) * ([log v] of (base))))

And to prove this works:

10 ^ (b log a) = x >Setting up the equation
log 10 ^ (b log a) = log x >Property of logarithms
(b log a) log 10 = log x >Bringing the exponent down
b log a = log x >log 10 = 1
log (a ^ b) = log x >Bringing the exponent back to the base
a ^ b = x >Getting rid of log

Firedrake969

-5^2.

I support… the workaround doesn't perfectly work.

log base X of a negative number is undefined. (unless in some rare cases the base is negative, but that doesn't happen in Scratch)

Last edited by Firedrake969 (Nov. 17, 2013 20:53:34)

'17 rickoid

bf97b44a7fbd33db070f6ade2b7dc549

1234abcdcba4321

Well, you could always do

if <(base) > [0]> then
([10 ^ v] of ((power) * ([log v] of (base))))
else
    ((0) - ([10^ v] of ((power) * ([log v] of ([abs v] of (base))))))
end

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Firedrake969

Bumping because of a duplicate I found.

The workaround doesn't allow for negative numbers. ^ does.

'17 rickoid

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seanbobe

savaka wrote:
I understand all these work, but wouldn't a block be way easier for new Scratchers? I have no idea what logarithms are.

correct
you dont teach logarithms in 5th grade!

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Firedrake969

Some of us did

But yeah, for some odd reason, kids are taught exponents way before logs, but logs and exponents are analogous to multiplication and division.

'17 rickoid

bf97b44a7fbd33db070f6ade2b7dc549

mitchboy

scratchisthebest wrote:
Even better than that huge script: this block!

you call that huge? that's a rather simple script.

Firedrake969 wrote:
Bumping because of a duplicate I found.

The workaround doesn't allow for negative numbers. ^ does.

yes it does. all you have to do is add this:

if <(x) < [0]> then
set [result v] to ((1) / (result))
end

and tell me one other reason to add this other than for making a calculator. sorry, but i think this is very low on the st's priorities.

Last edited by mitchboy (Nov. 20, 2013 00:12:56)

Capsicum annuum.

mathfreak231

DadOfMrLog wrote:

define result = (x) ^ (y)
if <(y) = [0]> then
  set [result v] to [1] // yes, we also include 0^0=1  :O

Last time I checked, 0^0 was undefined.

i have grown as a person. and ive grown, literally. none of my posts from before 2022 represent me accurately.

DadOfMrLog

mathfreak231 wrote:
Last time I checked, 0^0 was undefined.

Technically, it's an "indeterminate form", yes.

However, for practical computation it's typically given the value one - and doing that also helps along several useful mathematical theorems…

(EDIT: actually, wikipedia gives a really decent overview of the 0^0 question, including treatment on computers.)

Firedrake969 wrote:
The workaround doesn't allow for negative numbers. ^ does.

See my (supposedly really long) script for a slightly more thorough treatment of negative numbers.

However, note that a^b with both a & b negative (and b not an integer) is certainly not for the faint-hearted - I'd be really interested to know how the proponents of the a^b block would see it behaving under such situations…

Last edited by DadOfMrLog (Nov. 20, 2013 02:26:36)

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jh1234l

Poemon1_REMIX wrote:
SuperNicky wrote:
power what do you mean power?
like 5^2 = 25, or 2^3 = 8.

(^ is power)

Basically, if you have 5^5, it is 5x5x5x5x5. If you have 5^4, it is 5x5x5x5, and so on.
Basically, is the number multiplying by itself that many times.

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jh1234l

A () ^ () block is not necessary right now, as you could just use the workaround and add a script to check if it is zero.
However, it is certainly nice to have.

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1234abcdcba4321

And, wouldn't the workaround work, if you just put an abs() around the base value?

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ErnieParke

1234abcdcba4321 wrote:
And, wouldn't the workaround work, if you just put an abs() around the base value?

No, it wouldn't work because let's take the example:

2^3

It equals 8. Meanwhile:

(-2)^3

It equals -8. Then you get into the problem of fractional powers, and I haven't been able to figure that out.

Pointing out,

ErnieParke

goldfish678

I think the scratch team might have said they're not going to add it and there's a workaround.

Photoguy77

I certainly support this!

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savaka

scratchisthebest wrote:
by this logic, we can remove “move (10) steps”

why not just use
go to x: ((x position) + ([cos v] of ((direction)*(amt)))) y ((x position) + ([sin v] of ((direction)*(amt))))
i mean jeez so simple

Scratch is made to be for kids to learn how to program. It's not for professionals. I don't know how to use trigonometry to move a sprite.

supero

Or this too!

((x) * ((x) * ((x) * (.....))))

Just keep repeating it as many powers as you need it to.

Last edited by supero (Dec. 23, 2013 00:58:44)

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savaka

This makes me think, they should add this:

(() √ ()) // category=operators

Last edited by savaka (Dec. 26, 2013 23:17:03)

frodewin

Support for a new ((x) ^ (y)) block.
1. it is simpler than other solutions
2. it is faster than other solutions
3. at least in the form ((x) ^ (2)) it will be used a lot
4. young scratchers (below 10) might not know what ^is, but the same holds for log, sin, cos, mod, … - at least the code of others becomes easier to read

((x) ^ (y))

(but in green)

Last edited by frodewin (Dec. 23, 2013 18:06:47)

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mariobros406

You mean like

(() ^ ()) // category=operators

Anyway…

savaka wrote:
This makes me think, they should add this:
(() √ ()) // category=operators

That block kinda already exists:

([sqrt v] of ())

Also, that block would make you input the answer. It would be a boolean block, not a reporter block.

Last edited by mariobros406 (Dec. 23, 2013 21:02:41)

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