JonathanSchaffer wrote:

Marb1 wrote:

I totally agree. I got alerted for the Cantonese word “Fook” except with U instead of OO.

Why would you use that word anyway?

It's a Chinese word. It's used a lot in Hong Kong: Chow Tai Fook, Hung Fook Tong etc

turkey3 wrote:

So much stuff to say. Where do I begin.

Marb1 wrote:

Actually, Scratch's standards confuse me. Apparently mild cartoon violence is OK, but I can get an alert for saying “What the heck is this project?”, “this sucks!”, “boring” or “0/10”? Real game reviews can have MUCH worse language! Kids need to learn to deal with mean criticism, especially if they're future app developers! Cuz a lot of people use a 0-10 rating system but it's biased as anything under like 6 or 7/10 is reportable. And most projects on Scratch really are boring.

When you are playing a project, watching a movie, playing a video game, or reading a book, you are a third person perspective to everything going on. Mild cartoon violence is within a game, it is not real life. When you are communicating to another human being, regardless of if it's in person or online, you are no longer in this third person, psychically distant viewership. You are now interacting with another human being. It's pretty clear that mild cartoon violence, such as slapping someone with a loaf of bread, would be unacceptable to do to a human being in real life. This is what distinguishes fiction and reality and why things in reality need to be taken to more severity.

Additionally, most people have already addressed that “this sucks” or “0/10” are rude things to say. Your argument that “We need to prepare these kids for the real world and toughen them up!” falls fairly flat. Your overall argument is:

"If A is something bad that people will be exposed to at an older age, then we should not try to reduce exposure to A at young ages because it's going to eventually come regardless."

You are going to need to create a strong reason why that conclusion is supported. When people get older, they start experiencing a lot of stuff they didn't when they were younger. And while “mean Internet comments” aren't by any means the worst thing in the world, let us all acknowledge that when people get older it shouldn't become more acceptable for them to be disrespectful. What we want are people old and young to respect everyone.

Cub56 wrote:

Complex things that can be done with Scratch
This is more true for games than other types of projects, but often very simple games get featured, and complex games often aren't. Seeing as the front page is the first thing people see, it doesn't do much to show the variety of projects that can be created. More complex projects should be featured as well - you can't assume they will get popular on their own.

The front page has more rows than the “featured projects” row, and the features projects are usually a great opportunity for some lucky Scratcher out there, who may not be the best skills-wise, to get some recognition and love. The “most loved” row can very well have some well-programmed games in it, so there's that.

Inkulumo wrote:

In my opinion, scratch should just have a sub-site, where all of the 10+ projects are stored, and it should have SLIGHTLY looser guidelines. Mild violence and gore would be allowed, and so would all the other “scary” games. Ex: FNAF, that 3d shooter griffpatch made that had to be dumbed down a bit, etc,.

No support for this at all. I'm looking at this from a business perspective. Getting an entire second site is not some small little thing. That site need infrastructure, moderation, etc. And it will have very little benefit. There is no doubt in my mind that having a site like this would not really increase the total amount of Scratch users at all. In fact, it's possible it may decrease because the community would be split up and divided.

Inkulumo wrote:

I am not very sure what the front page is trying to do. I guess it is to show the projects of stuff you are following. However the front page only really demotivates me. I see such simple projects get currated and featured. I see a project I spent a year making and that I put my soul into not even get currated. Seeing projects that took much less thought and effort put into them get so much love bothers me. It has come to the point where I always go onto my profile page when coming onto Scratch because I can't stand the low quality projects on the front page. If projects on the front page had more thought, effort and complexity to them I might actually use the front page again. However as of now I try to avoid it.

This site had 2.5 million users. Getting your project on the front page is not easy, regardless of how much work you put into it. That's just how the mathematics works. If you look at other websites like Reddit, getting to the front page is not easy at all either, and you'll see reposts even get to the front page at times. It's just how it is.

Also, another note about the front page projects. When I joined Scratch in 2011, the stuff on the front page was much different. Very different type of stuff. But it all has to do with demand. The type of projects that were in demand in 2011 are not in demand now. It's just how it is. It used to be more games, now it's more animations. Popular art styles have changed. The front page is still a great representation of what the majority of people on Scratch seem to like, even if they are a minority here on the forums.

TheMonsterOfTheDeep wrote:

If there was some way to get more of the people introduced to Scratch to become interested in programming, I imagine that people would naturally want to make more advanced projects. But I don't quite know how to do that.

The whole idea of Scratch is that you discover by yourself how complex stuff can be done with seemingly simple things. I don't think we need to be spoon-fed crazily-programmed games in order to make us realize you can do a lot with Scratch. Plus, eventually we want people to move on from Scratch, that is, if they ever plan to get into serious programming. Scratch does a perfect job of introducing people to programming I believe.

Well, a movie rated G can have those insults in it, but any violence bumps the rating to PG.

Could people from now on only quote what they need to quote rather than lots of quotes inside quotes to save space? Thanks

@Marb1: in a G rated movie no human being is actually being insulted because they're actors who are acting or cartoon figures. That's like saying R rated movies having people do horrible things to each other makes it okay for people 17 or older in real life to do those horrible things to each other.

removed

Exactly, it's not like hurting themselves has to be censored from kids

100% support - Scratch is supposed to be a site, not a babysitter.

Soooooooo much support. Scratch isn't just for young kids! It should more emphasis on complex programming, not just a project where the scratch cat rotates.

But I feel the point of Scratch is to give you the basics, and then let you figure out the rest. Otherwise it wouldn't be so fun!

But yes, I can agree that Scratch should be more for all ages. We have Scratch Jr. so maybe making Scratch a bit more “advanced” would be a good idea!

KJRYoshi07 wrote:

It should more emphasis on complex programming, not just a project where the scratch cat rotates.

Well, here's the thing - some users might start off by making a project like that.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with someone making a simple project or a project that doesn't focus on coding. I actually remember the Scratch Team member Harakou once said that while they appreciate users learning to code on the site, they're not going to enforce it.

LionHeart70 wrote:

KJRYoshi07 wrote:

It should more emphasis on complex programming, not just a project where the scratch cat rotates.

Well, here's the thing - some users might start off by making a project like that.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with someone making a simple project or a project that doesn't focus on coding. I actually remember the Scratch Team member Harakou once said that while they appreciate users learning to code on the site, they're not going to enforce it.

I think they should still stay up, but more complex projects get featured. I also agree with the OP that the tips page should have more complex projects.

Semi-support.
Scratch was created for beginners; they need the basic tools. When they get the hang of simple programming, they can move onto more complex coding sites, like Python.
On the other hand, I do agree that the tips bar should have more complex tutorials, not just display the tutorials available in the editor.

i know c++ bit

geizerpro wrote:

i know c++ bit

Please don't necropost,


To the OP, i fully support this, scratch is a visual programming language and its just that, people use the “social” aspect of scratch too much,

Scratch needs to be more focused on programming

I support this till my last breath

With love

when green flag clicked
forever
> SUPPORT
end

While all the suggestions on this seem to be solving ways to make it less childish and more on programming, the suggestions seem like they can all work without each other, thus I don't believe this qualifies as a proper list of suggestions.

1.2 What would count as “closely related” suggestions?

pause project ::control

resume project ::control

Those are so closely alike that they go together.

“Changing usernames”
“Snip inactive usernames”

Those don't exactly go together like the above list of suggestions. The first two couldn't function without each other. The last two are both about usernames, but are different enough to warrant their own topics.

Imagine if users made lists of suggestions, saying they're “for Scratch, so they're similar”. Don't you are where it breaks down at that point?

(Those are just examples. The first two are duplicates, and the last two are rejected, so please don't suggest them!)

For more information, please click the orange link in my signature. Thanks!

There are highschool kids (ages 15-20) so we can fairly teach basics of the abstract aspects of computation

1. Mathematical Logic: Logical AND, OR, NOT etc.

2. Set theory

3. Relation and Relational Algebra

4. Boolean algebra

5. Logic Gates and circuit using logic gates

6. Programming using logic circuits and binary storage: Simplified examples and simulations.

7. Low level and high level programming language

8. Formal Language: Why programing languages are “Languages”?



We should encourage discussion, question answer and problem-solving on above aspects.

Codebeginner459 wrote:

There are highschool kids (ages 15-20) so we can fairly teach basics of the abstract aspects of computation

1. Mathematical Logic: Logical AND, OR, NOT etc.

2. Set theory

3. Relation and Relational Algebra

4. Boolean algebra

5. Logic Gates and circuit using logic gates

6. Programming using logic circuits and binary storage: Simplified examples and simulations.

7. Low level and high level programming language

8. Formal Language: Why programing languages are “Languages”?



We should encourage discussion, question answer and problem-solving on above aspects.

Even though there are people of that age group; scratch is aimed for younger people.

FloralAnimator wrote:

Codebeginner459 wrote:

Even though there are people of that age group; scratch is aimed for younger people.

I did not mean to exclude young children.

PS: young children are highly capable of taking abstract concept. You can teach young kids the concept of union, intersection, and, or, not etc in very intuitive way. Notably Mary Everest Boole (George Boole's spouse) wrote philosophy and fun of algebra it is supposed to be written for young children.

I partially agree. I think Scratch should have a focus on ALL ages, but not just programming. I hate dislike the 3.0 sprite editor, because it isn't made for making art. (The 2.0 sprite editor was the best though, in my opinion. I used bitmap.)