Make an announcement about AI (and Face Sensing)

KangaCoder

Updated suggestion starting from post #11

During the Scratch Conference, they announced that they were planning on introducing the Face Sensing blocks to Scratch this fall. There seems to be pull requests in GitHub indicating that it is ready. I think that they can make an announcement about this (if they aren't already drafting one already). After all, we got an update on the new thumbnail feature, so it definitely seems like they are open to sharing upcoming updates somewhat in advance. Plus, the Face Sensing blocks aren't exactly “new”, so it's not going to be a huge surprise compared to previous updates. We've known about them since 2021, and I've seen a bunch of people, like in QaS, asking when they will be coming to Scratch. If they aren't drafting an announcement (like the thumbnail one) yet, I think this would be great. Sort of like, “thanks for waiting, we've been testing them, and now they're coming to Scratch!”.

And, since these blocks use AI, I think it would be great to slip in stuff about AI that I've mentioned above, such as how these blocks use AI (just a general explanation, emphasizing that the data is secure and not publicly shared), their experimentation with generative AI (based on the Medium post from ericr), and how they have no plans to add gen-AI to Scratch (also in the Medium post). There could be emphasis on how Scratch is currently experimenting with other creative ways to use AI (again, no direct mention of the CLA) that will not eliminate, but enhance creativity - like how these Face Sensing blocks are trying to do.

I think this is much less controversial than my original suggestion as it highlights an upcoming feature many have been excited about, and as an addendum, provides some context about the Scratch Team's views on AI.

Old Suggestion
There's been a lot of wondering about Scratch 4.0 and AI by many members of the community, both of which we've known about since last year (whether through job postings, the Annual Report this year, the 2025 Conference, blog posts on Medium, etc.). There's also a lot of misconceptions about 4.0 and AI, whether it's generative AI and “AI slop” coming to Scratch to ruin creativity or completely new features coming to 4.0, that's causing concerns and criticism from those who don't truly understand what the Scratch Team is planning.

So, I'm suggesting that there should be an announcement helping to clarify - or, if a topic in Announcements would draw too much attention, maybe a sticky in QaS? After all, all the info about Scratch 4.0 and AI (the CLA) is out there, like on Medium or the Scratch Conference recordings which were just publicly released on YouTube, it's just many people won't be able to find those resources. A forum post with links to these sources would be incredibly helpful and would hopefully help clear up any false ideas or concerns. I've made a project about it and a corresponding forum post in this topic as to what it could look like: https://scratch.mit.edu/discuss/topic/834371/

If I were against this suggestion, I could see one argument being this public info may not be final/it might give a false sense of “wow! a new chatbot!”. This is valid, as you don't want necessarily want to draw too much attention to a new feature still in development, but the Scratch Team has already drawn a lot of attention with hints of AI and 4.0 - and haven't clarified what this whole thing is about. Though, I'm obviously not a member of the Scratch Team, so there may be another reason we don't know of that they've decided to share about the CLA everywhere but directly on Scratch.

They make it pretty clear in the Conference video that these are sketches/prototypes and things are still in development (something I've harked on a lot as well). And so far, discussion has been relatively constructive and positive; comments on this project and this one include a lot of thoughtful comments, as well as users saying “oh, this is actually different and better than what I thought they were doing”. Of course, you will get people who criticize and say “AI is bad” and “it shouldn't be on scratch”, but it's already too late to consider now that the CLA is already in development (and showcased live before).

TL;DR: To help people understand exactly what type of AI is coming to Scratch 4.0, an announcement (or forum sticky) compiling all the publicly released info we have about AI into a single topic would help clear up a lot of confusion and concern.

Last edited by KangaCoder (Aug. 17, 2025 14:49:10)

Toodchop

I don't know if they are allowed to make an announcement of those or not.

Last edited by Toodchop (Aug. 16, 2025 03:10:05)

Za-Chary

I'm not sure if even the Scratch Team knows yet about “exactly” what type of AI is coming. We have all the information they have given so far, but at the end of the day, the AI is still in development and so it is not yet clear what specifically it will look like, how it will function, what it's capable of, etc.

The way I see it, there are two types of Scratchers. Suppose that someone is curious about what the AI is supposed to be. Then either:

the Scratcher will be happy with whatever information you give them in e.g. your project, in which case they don't need an announcement;
the Scratcher will not be happy with that information (“All AI is bad, this is bad”), in which case I sort of doubt that an announcement forum post would convince them otherwise.

It's worth noting that a forum announcement is going to carry far more weight than what a few Scratch Team members (informally?) say in public. When making an announcement, several Scratch Team members actually work together writing and proofreading it to make sure that it conveys the information that they want. For this reason, it is best if they hold off on making announcements until they know for sure what the AI is going to do.

Remember also that the current timeline for Scratch 4.0 is the second half of 2026 — and who knows if that will be delayed — so I'm not sure if making an announcement about a Scratch 4.0 feature a year (or more!) ahead of time is the right move.

I'm not really sure if all of what I said is something you already addressed or thought about, so I'll end with this:

KangaCoder wrote:
TL;DR: To help people understand exactly what type of AI is coming to Scratch 4.0, an announcement (or forum sticky) compiling all the publicly released info we have about AI into a single topic would help clear up a lot of confusion and concern.

Is there a reason why we need an announcement specifically, if simply spreading around the aforementioned projects gets the job done?

KangaCoder

Za-Chary wrote:
I'm not sure if even the Scratch Team knows yet about “exactly” what type of AI is coming. We have all the information they have given so far, but at the end of the day, the AI is still in development and so it is not yet clear what specifically it will look like, how it will function, what it's capable of, etc.

That's true, but the idea of AI has already been circulating around Scratch. Maybe the Scratch Team doesn't need to do a detailed dive into the CLA, rather just a brief explanation of this chat bot and, more importantly, the motives, ethics, and idea for enhancing creativity that they've highlighted through their Medium posts. The current idea running around is that this AI will take away creativity and be something that does everything for you, which is not the intended purpose of the CLA (at least what we've seen so far).

Za-Chary wrote:
The way I see it, there are two types of Scratchers. Suppose that someone is curious about what the AI is supposed to be. Then either:
the Scratcher will be happy with whatever information you give them in e.g. your project, in which case they don't need an announcement;

This is great, if they're able to come across a project (right now, I know of just 2 discussing this topic).

Za-Chary wrote:
the Scratcher will not be happy with that information (“All AI is bad, this is bad”), in which case I sort of doubt that an announcement forum post would convince them otherwise.

In this case, there's not much to do, as they likely have and will continue to have a negative view towards AI and using it on Scratch. There are definitely going to be people who say this - about pretty much any update, but, like I mentioned, AI has been planned and development has started so there's really no going back to “no AI”. Most of the backlash about AI is because people think that there will be generative AI (like AI art) and such coming to Scratch, when the Scratch Team has mentioned clearly that they do not plan on adding that; there have been multiple studios/projects/forum posts created against gen-AI on Scratch, which is simply a result of lack of/misinformation.

Za-Chary wrote:
It's worth noting that a forum announcement is going to carry far more weight than what a few Scratch Team members (informally?) say in public. When making an announcement, several Scratch Team members actually work together writing and proofreading it to make sure that it conveys the information that they want. For this reason, it is best if they hold off on making announcements until they know for sure what the AI is going to do.

This is certainly true, however, they've already written about this in the past, such as their blog posts on Medium. Like I mentioned earlier in this post, maybe they don't need to highlight the specifics of the CLA, but plucking out important details like “generative AI is not coming to Scratch” and “this will enhance, not eliminate creativity” would be useful.

Za-Chary wrote:
Remember also that the current timeline for Scratch 4.0 is the second half of 2026 — and who knows if that will be delayed — so I'm not sure if making an announcement about a Scratch 4.0 feature a year (or more!) ahead of time is the right move.

Again, this is certainly true, however, the idea of AI has been circulating around for quite some time. If the Scratch Team is able to give some info about what is and is not coming, it would help ease a lot of misinformed confusion and concern.

Za-Chary wrote:
KangaCoder wrote:
TL;DR: To help people understand exactly what type of AI is coming to Scratch 4.0, an announcement (or forum sticky) compiling all the publicly released info we have about AI into a single topic would help clear up a lot of confusion and concern.
Is there a reason why we need an announcement specifically, if simply spreading around the aforementioned projects gets the job done?

I mean, it would be great for people to indeed spread these projects or make their own, but that wouldn't be as effective as an announcement. Right now, I would say less than 2,000 people have viewed the 2 projects I mentioned above, which is a very small portion of the community.

So, I guess I'll make a slight modification to this suggestion: rather than discussing too much about the CLA (such as including screenshots), an announcement using previously published material on Medium about what AI is coming to Scratch, the ethics and motives behind it, and how it will not kill creativity would clear up any misinformation and lack of information.

10goto10

KangaCoder wrote:
Right now, I would say less than 2,000 people have viewed the 2 projects I mentioned above, which is a very small portion of the community.

More fun with statistics. Two thousand views might actually be a very large percentage of the number of Scratchers with questions or concerns. It’s probably not in the best interest in the Scratch Team to increase the concern level in the community by posting a news item on the front page or even making an official sticky announcement.

I listened to Andy’s talk and came away believing that they didn’t want any open community involvement right now. There is no open testing. There is no open discussion with the Scratch Team on the design or effort. There is nothing for us to do except sit and wait. Telling a large number of people in a highly visible announcement to not be concerned or critical about a ‘closed project’ might have the opposite effect.

KangaCoder

10goto10 wrote:
KangaCoder wrote:
Right now, I would say less than 2,000 people have viewed the 2 projects I mentioned above, which is a very small portion of the community.
More fun with statistics. Two thousand views might actually be a very large percentage of the number of Scratchers with questions or concerns. It’s probably not in the best interest in the Scratch Team to increase the concern level in the community by posting a news item on the front page or even making an official sticky announcement.

Whatever the percentage is (we'll likely never know), why is it not a good idea to share the idea behind AI coming to Scratch? How will it bring concern if what I'm suggesting is for them to use their existing blog posts about the ethics, motives, etc. to simply explain their beliefs. I modified my suggestion so that it doesn't necessarily need to focus on the CLA as much.

10goto10 wrote:
I listened to Andy’s talk and came away believing that they didn’t want any open community involvement right now. There is no open testing. There is no open discussion with the Scratch Team on the design or effort. There is nothing for us to do except sit and wait.

Where was this mentioned or hinted? Here's the recording, if you'd like to point out a timestamp. In the very beginning where Tif talks about this being “a youth centered approach” and they “want to address their concerns” by making a list of them “after talking with a lot of kids” (which they showcased as including “AI slop,” “robot takeover,” and others). At the very end, they share a link to a feedback form on the Medium post.

Yes, they do mention that the CLA is nowhere near completion, but how does that mean they don't need/want any feedback whether in the past or in the future? Because it's nowhere near completion, that may be a reason why they don't want feedback - maybe they need to do more testing or planning first? Still, this isn't the point of my (updated) suggestion. It's not to highlight the CLA in its entirety.

10goto10 wrote:
Telling a large number of people in a highly visible announcement to not be concerned or critical about a ‘closed project’ might have the opposite effect.

Again, the focus would not be on the CLA, but the motives/beliefs. Most people are already concerned about AI, much of which stems from misinformation/lack of information about what the Scratch Team is planning.

10goto10

KangaCoder wrote:
10goto10 wrote:
I listened to Andy’s talk and came away believing that they didn’t want any open community involvement right now. There is no open testing. There is no open discussion with the Scratch Team on the design or effort. There is nothing for us to do except sit and wait.
Where was this mentioned or hinted? Here's the recording, if you'd like to point out a timestamp. In the very beginning where Tif talks about this being “a youth centered approach” and they “want to address their concerns” by making a list of them “after talking with a lot of kids” (which they showcased as including “AI slop,” “robot takeover,” and others). At the very end, they share a link to a feedback form on the Medium post.

I don’t believe that all of the sessions are on youtube. There was one where Andy talked about debugging use of AI and took questions from people. I can’t find that on YouTube.

The medium feedback seems to be a review of the whole conference. I actually did post an observation about AI and the feature of presenting sprites to a programmer but never got a response. Most likely it went into the bit bucket.

I would turn your question around and ask where did they offer to have open engagement with the community or open participation with their prototype. “Talking with a bunch of kids” is not the same thing as having open dialog with the community. When they are ready for that then that will be the time for an announcement.

KangaCoder wrote:
Most people are already concerned about AI

Most people? There is some community angst but why do you think it’s most people?

AI is already being used on Scratch. Some of the help offered in the Help with Scripts looks like something generated with AI. There are links in signatures to AI for Scratch. The potential source for anxiety goes beyond what the Scratch Team will be adding to Scratch. Unless the Scratch Team will be opening up an opportunity to actually do something then I don’t see the point of an announcement on their website.

mrsrec

Za-Chary wrote:
the Scratcher will not be happy with that information (“All AI is bad, this is bad”), in which case I sort of doubt that an announcement forum post would convince them otherwise

I agree with this. I intentionally did not mention the “CLA” in my project for this exact reason. I don't think drawing attention to it is a good idea and an official ST post would not help, in my opinion. Both by putting it on a larger stage and because if someone is worried that lots of companies (including nonprofits) are adding AI just for the sake of adding AI whether it'd be useful or not, a post from a Scratcher would be more likely to convince them otherwise than a post from the ST (of course the ST stands behind what the ST is doing!)

So at this point, I think Scratch projects are enough. Words and ideas from Scratchers are very powerful at making their way around the community. Jvvg's collection of Wiki essays are proof of this.

Last edited by mrsrec (Aug. 16, 2025 20:29:39)

Za-Chary

10goto10 wrote:
Telling a large number of people in a highly visible announcement to not be concerned or critical about a ‘closed project’ might have the opposite effect.

This is a good point that I forgot about, especially with something as controversial as AI. Scratchers sometimes say that the Scratch Team should have announced, for example, the 2021 studio update earlier, for the sake of transparency. There are good things with transparency, but I think a lot (most?) of the outrage generated by the studio update would not have been removed if the Scratch Team announced it earlier. At best the outrage would have happened earlier, and at worst the outrage would have happened twice: once from the announcement, and another once the update is implemented.

If an announcement must happen early, I think it would be best if it was posted at least close to the end of development of any AI features on Scratch.

KangaCoder wrote:
So, I guess I'll make a slight modification to this suggestion: rather than discussing too much about the CLA (such as including screenshots), an announcement using previously published material on Medium about what AI is coming to Scratch, the ethics and motives behind it, and how it will not kill creativity would clear up any misinformation and lack of information.

Indeed, I'm afraid the revised suggestion doesn't alleviate my concerns, since we all (including the Scratch Team) don't know exactly what the AI features will look like, so it's hard to say “what AI is coming to Scratch.”

We can certainly say what is not coming to Scratch (AI image generation) due to the Medium blog post, the rejected suggestions list, etc…. but I'm not sure if we need an announcement detailing what is not coming to Scratch.

mingo-gag

Support

I feel like this is a good idea, so the community would know what the AI is going to be and not cause any confusion

KangaCoder

Thanks to everyone above for the constructive thoughts. I certainly do agree with aspects of your arguments, however, it would be pretty pointless for me just break down your points again, as we wouldn't really have any new discussion - simply going around in circles.

So, I'm thinking of changing this suggestion pretty much completely; there will be no mention of the CLA at all. During the Conference, they announced that they were planning on introducing the Face Sensing blocks to Scratch this fall. There seems to be pull requests in GitHub indicating that it is ready. I think that they can make an announcement about this (if they aren't already drafting one already). After all, we got an update on the new thumbnail feature, so it definitely seems like they are open to sharing upcoming updates somewhat in advance. Plus, the Face Sensing blocks aren't exactly “new”, so it's not going to be a huge surprise compared to previous updates. We've known about them since 2021, and I've seen a bunch of people, like in QaS, asking when they will be coming to Scratch. If they aren't drafting an announcement (like the thumbnail one) yet, I think this would be great. Sort of like, “thanks for waiting, we've been testing them, and now they're coming to Scratch!”.

And, since these blocks use AI, I think it would be great to slip in stuff about AI that I've mentioned above, such as how these blocks use AI (just a general explanation, emphasizing that the data is secure and not publicly shared), their experimentation with generative AI (based on the Medium post from ericr), and how they have no plans to add gen-AI to Scratch (also in the Medium post). There could be emphasis on how Scratch is currently experimenting with other creative ways to use AI (again, no direct mention of the CLA) that will not eliminate, but enhance creativity - like how these Face Sensing blocks are trying to do.

I think this is much less controversial than my original suggestion as it highlights an upcoming feature many have been excited about, and as an addendum, provides some context about the Scratch Team's views on AI.

OSCVoices

I personally think ai does not work on websites , ai should only be a learning and creative tool , not used for age verification or face scanning

But I think these blocks would be cool

My signature was ran over by Asgore

Za-Chary

KangaCoder wrote:
So, I'm thinking of changing this suggestion pretty much completely; there will be no mention of the CLA at all. During the Conference, they announced that they were planning on introducing the Face Sensing blocks to Scratch this fall. There seems to be pull requests in GitHub indicating that it is ready. I think that they can make an announcement about this (if they aren't already drafting one already).

Overall this sounds like a great change to your suggestion. Thanks for thinking carefully about our feedback!

KangaCoder wrote:
After all, we got an update on the new thumbnail feature, so it definitely seems like they are open to sharing upcoming updates somewhat in advance.

The Scratch Team has also shared a couple of updates in the past. [1 2] I can't remember if these were shared ahead of time, though. I'm noticing that a lot of people are confused about the upcoming thumbnail update, asking when it will be released. So far it's been about 3 weeks… For this reason, on releasing an announcement for face sensing blocks, the Scratch Team should either (1) wait until the blocks are actually released, or (2) state in the announcement around when they will be released (for example, something like “around late October” … and hopefully keep that promise!).

The fact that face sensing blocks are not new certainly helps their case in making an announcement ahead of time, though. If an announcement must be made early, it certainly makes more sense to do it for face sensing blocks than for the CLA*.

KangaCoder wrote:
And, since these blocks use AI, I think it would be great to slip in stuff about AI that I've mentioned above, […]

I think this is a great opportunity to describe how AI can be used (and useful) in Scratch. I think the emphasis of the announcement should still be about the face-sensing blocks, but using it as a way to formally introduce AI to Scratch sounds like a good idea.

*Extremely unrelated: CLA is also the abbreviation for the “College of Liberal Arts” at the University of Minnesota. It's kinda funny to see this abbreviation come up in a completely different context. :)

KangaCoder

bump - not much to really add lol, pretty much agree with you Za-Chary.

Za-Chary wrote:
The Scratch Team has also shared a couple of updates in the past. [1 2] I can't remember if these were shared ahead of time, though.

Based on some of the replies, it seems like after/right when the updates were released.

KangaCoder

bump

KangaCoder

KangaCoder wrote:
bump

mingo-gag

I was looking through my posts and found this might as well say something, they made an Announcement on Face Sensing, not sure about the AI thought

pippy2011eight

support, people are angry and mad about this, when they don't really know what it is.

Haycat2009

A question: Who have they trained the AI on? They have not worked for me, and apparently many Face Sensors work better for certain ethnicities than others.

Discuss Scratch