NinjaStar123 wrote:

cheddargirl wrote:

long quote

I see your point, but some people are capable of better if the just put their minds to it. Some just don't even try at all. Shouldn't the team have a rating form for projects, and those who pass are acceptable as feature-able? I just really hate that some people slack and get featured, but people who work hard don't.

I don't think you see cheddargirl's point. You have no idea whether someone slacked off or worked hard to make their project that got featured! I remember when i was younger working with Scratch, I made a fighting game with like 4 characters and 5 maps and it wasn't incredibly well programmed either. It was simple but it took a long time for me and I was proud of it!

And as for featuring projects that are easy to remix, remixing is one of the core concepts of the Scratch website and it's actually where the name “Scratch” comes from.

See, that's different. If you made something simple, but put time into it. What I'm talking about is simple projects with little effort that get featured.

And yes, I see her point. And again, not all of the projects are effortless, just some of those keep popping up in that featured project section.

And I'm not all about this ‘remix’ thing either. Lots of times, people remix without changing anything. That's basically just stealing the work someone else made.

Except for coloring contest, character RP forms, etc. of course, which are meant to be remixed.

Mr. Nose's adventure, for example. It's simple, but I can tell @StickyPup put time into that project. The platforms are simply shaded, but Mr. Nose has a lot of detail, and the background is nice too. These are the featured projects I like to see.

Here's something I've seen. When some people remixed a project and didn't change anything, people start praising that user. But they just remixed it! If you are going to praise that user, praise the original owner as well.

NinjaStar123 wrote:

See, that's different. If you made something simple, but put time into it. What I'm talking about is simple projects with little effort that get featured.

But, I'm asking you, how do you know there wasn't effort put into it?

Let's use a “make a hamburger project”.

I make the bun sprite, the patty sprite and the toppings, which I would make multiple sprites for the latter.
Then some variables for the toppings, like “When flag is clicked, hide” and “If a certain topping equals done, show”.

But that's basically it. No complex or even decent programming, and most of the time the art is barely worked on. They hardly try.
You should try different methods of art, possibly vector because most of those are drawn in bitmap. Get some coding tips before making the project, from the internet or another Scratcher. But some people don't try hard enough. The just lay back and get praised for doing virtually nothing. It's not fair to the lesser-known Scratchers who are great artist or programmers.

OK but consider this: the author of this “Make a hamburger” project could be like, 10 years old. To you, it might seem like there was no effort, but to a young 5th grade kid this project is something they spent hours on, and it's their best work of all time. You have literally no idea how hard people work on these projects, there is actually no way of telling.

Also you act as if people are deliberately making these projects, knowing that theyll get featured and be famous. This really is not the case, most of these scratchers AREN'T well known and are just making projects for fun! They don't “lay back and get praised for doing virtually nothing,” they make what they think is a good project and the Scratch Team decides it should be featured for whatever reason.

Have you read the goals for featuring before?

Paddle2See wrote:

These are the kind of things we're looking for:
1. simple projects
2. complex projects
3. projects that show an innovative use of Scratch
4. project that promote collaboration and remixing
5. projects that show the diversity in our community (gender, age, culture, country, interests, etc)
6. project that different kinds of people would find enjoyable
7. projects that inspire

The first one I see. Now I can understand what you were saying about the effort. But some of the people aren't in that age range.

And I'm not acting like they no they'll get featured. No one knows, people just recommend projects. Sharing a project with little effort isn't good, unless it's like a logo or a project made to be simple. I have seen people just be lazy and make simple projects, while so many are left out when they deserve it.

And there are goals, but I have many seen in this section simple projects, and yes the users who make them are lazy. Just lazy. They make something barely holding itself together, and it gets featured. Whatever is featured, is praised. And there are some not-so-well-known Scratchers who deserve this respect and acknowledgement.

NinjaStar123 wrote:

Sharing a project with little effort isn't good, unless it's like a logo or a project made to be simple. I have seen people just be lazy and make simple projects, while so many are left out when they deserve it.

Don't you know there are kids which only create the simple? Stop judging others' projects by their effort.

NinjaStar123 wrote:

Every time I look at the featured projects, it's one of those “make a food!” things, or something basic. People say “good effort”, but they only take a minute of their time to make something. Not to flog the users who make those projects, but you should put some serious time into those projects. Then, it'll be worth featuring.

And featured projects shouldn't be of a well-known Scratcher, users breath down their necks too much, so they know when their projects are shared. I mean the good Scratchers who aren't well-known. They deserve acknowledgement, too. Even if you aren't the best artist or programmer, put effort into it. I don't mean “Ugh, five minutes, I'm done.” , because that's pathetic. If you can't put some effort, you shouldn't be a Scratcher, because projects need effort to be true projects.

Effort is makes you a true Scratcher.

Guys, he's making a good point. There's a difference between simple and being lazy.

Iditaroid wrote:

A big factor they look at when featuring is remixability. If a project is easy to remix, then it's good for the Featured section!

That's arguable. If you can learn nothing by remixing a project, then it actually doesn't have remixability.

I'm not judging the little kids, PrincessPanda, I'm judging the older children. I said that in the part above.

But I think I know why the featured section is full of simpler projects.
People go around looking for a project, but Scratch has a decent amount of simpler projects, so they get featured.

AgentCNF wrote:

I totally agree. Most of the time, I don't even look at featured projects because I know that they aren't really the best projects. It seems like “featured” projects would be some of the best, but they're just not. I've been frustrated with the ST's choices for featured projects for a long time now. Even though a majority of us want to see high-end, good quality projects in the featured section, the ST just won't do it. That is why skilled Scratchers who try hard to make amazing projects will never get the honor of being featured.

And this is the last point I have to make.
I flamed the oreo maker one because I felt like this. You know why?
THE OREOS DIDN'T EVEN LOOK LIKE OREOS.

And yes, you judge it by the effort. You can't judge by the art skills or programming skills.

And then you'd try to say I said TO judge by that earlier. But I have something else.
I'd never judge by your art skills, but if you put your max effort, then that's good. But there are middle schoolers who are using 2nd grade art effort. You could do more. Vector is easier to use. (Like I said, try new methods.)

And effort doesn't mean you have “Griffpatch” skills. It just means you take your time and do your best. Quality and effort are to different things, and you guys seem to be mixing them up.

cheddargirl wrote:

It's rather trite and harsh to assume that users who are on the Featured Row aren't putting effort into their projects. As Zro716 hinted at earlier, expectations are going to be different among different age groups. It's also important to note that the same issue is at play when considering that not everyone has the same programming skill level, and what one will see as simple will not be the same to another user. It's prejudicial to not think of other users as not a true Scratcher if they don't meet your qualifications.

Most users forget or dismiss the fact that Scratch was intended for kids and those new to programming, that the Featured Row was intended to show off the diversity of projects on the Scratch website, and that everyone has a different spectrum of what is considered to be a “good” project. One's perceived expectation of a “good” project isn't always going to be same as another's, and we don't expect that everyone will like what they see for Featured. But if you're disappointed in the Featured Project of the day, then it's best to just chalk it up to differences and move on.

In the end, it doesn't make sense to vent about how the Featured Row is not showing of the projects that best fits your criteria, as there will always be others who will disagree. Instead, follow users whose projects and faves interest you. Find a studio whose topic you enjoy. Click on the tags of projects you faved and see where that leads you. Type in a project subject you're interested in and see what pops-up. You're not going to find that you want if you're not constantly putting effort into searching for it, after all. And if you're just relying on the Featured Row (or even the front page in general) to show you want you want, well, you're kinda left to “flog” yourself for not putting greater effort into the search, eh? ;P

That's incorrect, for the second paragraph. Just because I am a thirteen year old male, that does not mean that when I joined scratch a year ago I wasn't a noob. Because I sucked. But then you know what happened? I took actual, legitimate effort, funneled it into my projects, and now I'm already on the road to making 3D collision systems. Saying ‘different age groups have different expectations’ is unfair, because ‘different age groups’ really means anyone not trying to put effort into their projects and loving it because it has a picture of freddy in it.
If the featured row is bad projects because we suggest bad projects, then here's an idea.
STOP
ACCEPTING
THE
BAD
PROJECTS.

I mean, you guys are the ones in office. It's not even like we get to vote or anything, you probably just go to the last page and start adding these projects to the list. That's like, for lack of better example, letting every citizen make laws and the president just taking the top few out of the stacks to make real. Imagine how unfair that would be. You've been searching for this AMAZING answer on how to stop, say, domestic abuse (That's a tad bit dark to go in to though) and it's beaten by a law that makes eating fried chicken illegal. Congratulations, all those years of research— or days of programming, for comparison— for nothing. All with the added insult of NOT BEING ABLE TO EAT FRIED CHICKEN.

I thought scratch was supposed to help us learn, not praise us for putting no effort into our program.

TL;DR
Stop taking every suggestion just because it matches the criteria.

NinjaStar123. Your project “Astral Eye Monster” doesn't look to me like you put much effort into it, and yet you say sharing projects without putting effort into them is bad.