• De Nederlandstalige wiki is de minst actieve van alle acht bestaande wiki's, met slechts 45 inhoudelijke pagina's, geen wijzigingen in de afgelopen 30 dagen, en 51 gebruikers. Wij zijn ook van mening dat de meeste van deze pagina's sinds Scratch 3.0 verouderd zijn. Daardoor blijft er maar heel weinig bruikbare Nederlandstalige inhoud over en in sommige gevallen kan het ronduit misleidend zijn.
  
• We hebben de indruk dat de meeste Nederlanders volledig in staat zijn om de Engelstalige wiki te gebruiken (inderdaad doen velen dat al). Dit betekent dat de weinige bruikbare inhoud die er is, eigenlijk niet wordt gebruikt.
  
• Elke enkele wiki die we beheren vereist voor elke wiki wat inspanning. Dit betekent dat hoe meer wiki's er zijn hoe meer moeite het is om ze te onderhouden. En als de wiki's nutteloos zijn, is die inspanning dan helemaal verspild.
  

1. Iemand moet het heft in handen nemen, de Nederlandstalige Scratch-Wiki nieuw leven inblazen, de inhoud enorm uitbreiden en bijwerken, én
   
2. We moeten horen van mensen die de Engelstalige wiki niet gebruiken, maar de Nederlandstalige wiki wel. En die op overtuigende wijze kunnen aantonen dat er genoeg lezers zouden zijn voor een herleefde Nederlandstalige wiki om de moeite van het opnieuw opzetten ervan te rechtvaardigen.
   

• The Dutch wiki has been the least active of all 8 existing language wikis, with only 45 content pages in total, no edits in the last 30 days, and 51 total users. Of those 45 pages, we believe that most have been outdated since the release of Scratch 3.0. Thus, there is very little useful Dutch content remaining, and some could even be outright misleading.
  
• Our impression is that most Dutch people are perfectly capable of using the English wiki located at https://en.scratch-wiki.info, and indeed many already do, which means what little useful content is there is not actually used.
  
• Each separate wiki we maintain requires a baseline minimum of administrator effort which is wasted on a wiki with no activity. Additionally, in the modern landscape of AI crawlers that do not respect robots.txt, each wiki is another collection of URLs for crawlers to spam and slow down our infrastructure and therefore all the other wikis.
  

1. Consultation on whether the closure should happen (we are here)
   
2. Site notices (banners) announcing the pending closure
   
3. Wiki set to read-only while its public data is exported
   
4. Exported Dutch wiki data imported into the Test Scratch Wiki if possible or else uploaded as a single file to be stored and accessible in perpetuity
   
5. Wiki software disabled on https://nl.scratch-wiki.info and replaced with a soft redirect to the English wiki
   
6. https://nl.scratch-wiki.info hard redirected to English wiki in perpetuity
   

1. Someone would need to step up, revive the Dutch Scratch Wiki community, and massively expand and update the content, and
   
2. We would need to see testimonials from people who actually do use the Dutch wiki, to the exclusion of the English wiki, and who can make a convincing argument that there would be enough readers of a revived Dutch wiki to justify the effort of reviving it.
   

ScodexPerson wrote:

-snip-
I actually made an request for an account 1 month ago, but it's still not accepted. I really want to help. The downside is that i have a bad reputation of using machine translation, but i'm trying to improve myself.

ScodexPerson wrote:

I also have a friend that still uses the Dutch Wiki, but his biggest complain is that the entire wiki is outdated.

ScodexPerson wrote:

Even if there are only a few people per month who acrually views the wiki,

kenny2scratch wrote:

snip

xota wrote:

Dear Kenny (and ScoDexPerson),

Please reconsider closing the Dutch Wiki. I fully agree that the current status, mostly written 2014-2018, is not up to date, but that can change once new enthousiasts step in.

The people happy with the English wiki, have some mastery of English. The majority of Dutch/Flemish kids are not very good in English (yet) and strongly helped by explanation in their own language.

Best regards,

Joek (aka xota)

Jensvp2 wrote:

Honestly, even if it's not as active as the rest, it still is useful to many of Dutch speakers who don't know English (yet). Or very poor english skills. Especially in Belgium where they learn both French, Dutch and English, they'll have less focus on English because Belgium speaks both Dutch and French depending on where you are.

Jensvp2 wrote:

edit: is it self-hosted or not?

xota wrote:

I fully agree that the current status, mostly written 2014-2018, is not up to date, but that can change once new enthousiasts step in.

xota wrote:

The majority of Dutch/Flemish kids are not very good in English (yet) and strongly helped by explanation in their own language.

jackdebij wrote:

ik heb 5 goede redenen om nederlands wiki te behouden
namelijks:
(om dit bericht te kunnen tonen moet nederlands wiki behouden worden)

ScodexPerson wrote:

jackdebij wrote:

ik heb 5 goede redenen om nederlands wiki te behouden
namelijks:
(om dit bericht te kunnen tonen moet nederlands wiki behouden worden)

Ummm… Dit soort dingen doen gaat niet werken…

kenny2scratch wrote:

how difficult would it be for them to use the English wiki?

kenny2scratch wrote:

seems to claim that many/most kids start learning English at age 4-5

jackdebij wrote:

(om dit bericht te kunnen tonen moet nederlands wiki behouden worden)

jackdebij wrote:

jammer
#11

ScodexPerson wrote:

jackdebij wrote:

ik heb 5 goede redenen om nederlands wiki te behouden
namelijks:
(om dit bericht te kunnen tonen moet nederlands wiki behouden worden)

Ummm… Dit soort dingen doen gaat niet werken…

Jensvp2 wrote:

People around 7-10 may know basic English to understand sentences, but then again it depends on who they are. Some just aren't good in languages and only partly know English at higher ages. […] They can't even read or write yet until 3rd grade (5-6 years old), but only in Dutch. Personally I only really knew English good enough at like age 7-8 (4th grade)

kenny2scratch wrote:

jackdebij wrote:

jammer
#11

ScodexPerson wrote:

jackdebij wrote:

ik heb 5 goede redenen om nederlands wiki te behouden
namelijks:
(om dit bericht te kunnen tonen moet nederlands wiki behouden worden)

Ummm… Dit soort dingen doen gaat niet werken…

Yes, unfortunately if you can't list your “5 good reasons” here I can only assume they do not exist.

Jensvp2 wrote:

People around 7-10 may know basic English to understand sentences, but then again it depends on who they are. Some just aren't good in languages and only partly know English at higher ages. […] They can't even read or write yet until 3rd grade (5-6 years old), but only in Dutch. Personally I only really knew English good enough at like age 7-8 (4th grade)

Okay, this is good to know, thank you. I think that entirely obviates the argument that English in and of itself is sufficient. My remaining questions still stand, however: how much genuinely up-to-date - or at least useful - content is there on the Dutch wiki currently? And is there any reason to believe enough Dutch contributors will surface to bring the wiki back into usefulness? To what extent could Dutch readers simply machine-translate the English wiki and get a better result?

kenny2scratch wrote:

jackdebij wrote:

jammer
#11

ScodexPerson wrote:

jackdebij wrote:

ik heb 5 goede redenen om nederlands wiki te behouden
namelijks:
(om dit bericht te kunnen tonen moet nederlands wiki behouden worden)

Ummm… Dit soort dingen doen gaat niet werken…

Yes, unfortunately if you can't list your “5 good reasons” here I can only assume they do not exist.

Jensvp2 wrote:

People around 7-10 may know basic English to understand sentences, but then again it depends on who they are. Some just aren't good in languages and only partly know English at higher ages. […] They can't even read or write yet until 3rd grade (5-6 years old), but only in Dutch. Personally I only really knew English good enough at like age 7-8 (4th grade)

Okay, this is good to know, thank you. I think that entirely obviates the argument that English in and of itself is sufficient. My remaining questions still stand, however: how much genuinely up-to-date - or at least useful - content is there on the Dutch wiki currently? And is there any reason to believe enough Dutch contributors will surface to bring the wiki back into usefulness? To what extent could Dutch readers simply machine-translate the English wiki and get a better result?

kenny2scratch wrote:

My remaining questions still stand, however: 1: how much genuinely up-to-date - or at least useful - content is there on the Dutch wiki currently? And 2: is there any reason to believe enough Dutch contributors will surface to bring the wiki back into usefulness? To what extent could Dutch readers simply machine-translate the English wiki and get a better result?

ScodexPerson wrote:

kenny2scratch wrote:

My remaining questions still stand, however: 1: how much genuinely up-to-date - or at least useful - content is there on the Dutch wiki currently? And 2: is there any reason to believe enough Dutch contributors will surface to bring the wiki back into usefulness? To what extent could Dutch readers simply machine-translate the English wiki and get a better result?

1: There is currently not that much up-to-date info on the Dutch wiki. There is also not that much useful content on the wiki, but that can be changed if the wiki doesn't close.
2: Many Dutch people prefer content made by actual people who understands Dutch, and not by Google Translate. And, some people don't even have browsers that automaticly translates the website.

ScodexPerson wrote:

kenny2scratch wrote:

My remaining questions still stand, however: 1: how much genuinely up-to-date - or at least useful - content is there on the Dutch wiki currently? And 2: is there any reason to believe enough Dutch contributors will surface to bring the wiki back into usefulness? To what extent could Dutch readers simply machine-translate the English wiki and get a better result?

1: There is currently not that much up-to-date info on the Dutch wiki. There is also not that much useful content on the wiki, but that can be changed if the wiki doesn't close.
2: Many Dutch people prefer content made by actual people who understands Dutch, and not by Google Translate. And, some people don't even have browsers that automaticly translates the website.

PinkyPepper wrote:

Dank voor je bericht. Dat is inderdaad heel jammer. Helaas heb ik geen tijd om opnieuw veel energie in de Nederlandstalige Wiki te steken. Vond het wel heel leuk om te doen destijds en naar mijn mening staan er best een aantal (nog steeds) interessante artikelen op. Denk dat het alleen met een sponsor weer nieuw leven in te blazen is. Het is leuk dat jij er energie in wilt steken, maar je hebt meer mensen nodig en ook iemand die artikelen checkt op taalfouten en leesbaarheid.

Google Translate wrote:

Thanks for your message. That is indeed very unfortunate. Unfortunately, I don't have time to put a lot of energy into the Dutch Wiki again. I really enjoyed doing it back then and in my opinion, there are still quite a few interesting articles on it. I think it would only come back to life with a sponsor. It's great that you want to put energy into it, but you'll need more people and also someone to check articles for language errors and readability.