IloveRoblox003 wrote:

IloveRoblox003 wrote:

The Title is nice, but the reasoning isnt really good.

Bump

I forgor wrote:

“Scratch Team is too small” then they need to find a way to expand

And how will they provide the new team member's FUNDS? They are a nonprofit. It's like saying “Buy a house if you can't get a home”.

I still forgor wrote:

“Too complex” Scratch is for all types of people, not just beginners.

Scratch is AIMED for beginners.

kip22s wrote:

IloveRoblox003 wrote:

I forgor wrote:

“Scratch Team is too small” then they need to find a way to expand

And how will they provide the new team member's FUNDS? They are a nonprofit. It's like saying “Buy a house if you can't get a home”.

I still forgor wrote:

“Too complex” Scratch is for all types of people, not just beginners.

Scratch is AIMED for beginners.

_Paymer OP quotes.

IloveRoblox003 wrote:

IloveRoblox003 wrote:

The Title is nice, but the reasoning isnt really good.

Bump

I forgor wrote:

“Scratch Team is too small” then they need to find a way to expand

And how will they provide the new team member's FUNDS? They are a nonprofit. It's like saying “Buy a house if you can't get a home”.

I still forgor wrote:

“Too complex” Scratch is for all types of people, not just beginners.

Scratch is AIMED for beginners.

Scratch Team needs to find a way to convince big tech companies to lend them their best engineers, or at least gather more resources without angering the community. When you start hosting millions of projects worldwide, you are forced to expand, you cannot stay small.

Even if Scratch is aimed for beginners, it is still for all types of people. Scratch is meant to be a programming language like a room with a “low floor”(easy for beginners to learn) and “wide walls”(lots of capabilities to make anything people want).
Although Scratch is meant as a programming language for beginners, it still isn't fair to simply deflect many complex suggestions just because they could make beginners confused. Plus, from the experience of many users in this topic and across the forum, if they see a complex block they don't understand, they just ignore it.

IloveRoblox003 wrote:

kip22s wrote:

IloveRoblox003 wrote:

I forgor wrote:

“Scratch Team is too small” then they need to find a way to expand

And how will they provide the new team member's FUNDS? They are a nonprofit. It's like saying “Buy a house if you can't get a home”.

I still forgor wrote:

“Too complex” Scratch is for all types of people, not just beginners.

Scratch is AIMED for beginners.

_Paymer OP quotes.

Yep but nope

_Paymer wrote:

Bring Your Post Up

_Paymer wrote:

MagicCoder330 wrote:

Its like saying somebody already struggling to keep their home maintained should be focusing on building an ADU on top of it instead, and is lazy for not doing so.

You forgot the crucial part: if that person keeps struggling to keep their home maintained and doesn't get help, one single disaster would ruin their life. This is what's happening with Scratch. We can't stay in this state forever. If something happens, Scratch disappears.

_Paymer wrote:

Scratch Team needs to find a way to convince big tech companies to lend them their best engineers, or at least gather more resources without angering the community. When you start hosting millions of projects worldwide, you are forced to expand, you cannot stay small.

And how will they provide the new team member's FUNDS? They are a nonprofit. It's like saying “Buy a house if you can't get a home”.

_Paymer wrote:

Even if Scratch is aimed for beginners, it is still for all types of people. Scratch is meant to be a programming language like a room with a “low floor”(easy for beginners to learn) and “wide walls”(lots of capabilities to make anything people want).
Although Scratch is meant as a programming language for beginners, it still isn't fair to simply deflect many complex suggestions just because they could make beginners confused. Plus, from the experience of many users in this topic and across the forum, if they see a complex block they don't understand, they just ignore it.

Za-Chary wrote:

_Paymer wrote:

Many things such as 2D lists or BigNum have been either rejected for being too complex for Scratch's design goals, which are to simplify coding for beginners, or simply get ghosted for whole decades. Ironically, the addition of these “complex” blocks would actually make Scratch easier to use. […] Isn't this a contradiction?

No, because “Easier to create certain types of projects” is not the same thing as “Easier to use the editor.” The Scratch Team is primarily focused on the latter, which makes sense because Scratch is intended for beginner programmers. Too many blocks, and a new user would get overwhelmed and not even attempt to learn. As such, there needs to be a balance: there should be enough blocks for a new user to get started, but not so many that a new user gets overwhelmed.

chenzero1five wrote:

Za-Chary wrote:

_Paymer wrote:

Many things such as 2D lists or BigNum have been either rejected for being too complex for Scratch's design goals, which are to simplify coding for beginners, or simply get ghosted for whole decades. Ironically, the addition of these “complex” blocks would actually make Scratch easier to use. […] Isn't this a contradiction?

No, because “Easier to create certain types of projects” is not the same thing as “Easier to use the editor.” The Scratch Team is primarily focused on the latter, which makes sense because Scratch is intended for beginner programmers. Too many blocks, and a new user would get overwhelmed and not even attempt to learn. As such, there needs to be a balance: there should be enough blocks for a new user to get started, but not so many that a new user gets overwhelmed.

Y'know, we could just add a option to show or hide such advanced blocks…

_Paymer wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

Za-Chary wrote:

_Paymer wrote:

Many things such as 2D lists or BigNum have been either rejected for being too complex for Scratch's design goals, which are to simplify coding for beginners, or simply get ghosted for whole decades. Ironically, the addition of these “complex” blocks would actually make Scratch easier to use. […] Isn't this a contradiction?

No, because “Easier to create certain types of projects” is not the same thing as “Easier to use the editor.” The Scratch Team is primarily focused on the latter, which makes sense because Scratch is intended for beginner programmers. Too many blocks, and a new user would get overwhelmed and not even attempt to learn. As such, there needs to be a balance: there should be enough blocks for a new user to get started, but not so many that a new user gets overwhelmed.

Y'know, we could just add a option to show or hide such advanced blocks…

Yes, it is that easy.

Object_3 wrote:

trust me bro the scratch team is not gonna change, at least not from a forum post

It's been a year since my little mix-up and apology note already and NOTHING has happened since then

If you really wanna learn coding learn JavaScript or something. Not colorful Legos with code attached on the back of it.
I think what's really crazy on this site is that there is NOTHING for the more advanced kids. You are NEVER explained to how the blocks work internally because it will “stump the kiddies”. -_- That's how you learn. You see, get taught how it works, you understand, repeat. Stuff far off is SUPPOSED to look and be difficult for the people who just started! If the ST ran a course for math, 8th grade would still be at 2+2

chenzero1five wrote:

I'm honestly hoping they add stuff to learn more coding languages, I don't see a reason why this site should just be only teaching beginners.

FreshTheCat wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

I'm honestly hoping they add stuff to learn more coding languages, I don't see a reason why this site should just be only teaching beginners.

So like, make tutorials on how to do certain scratch stuff in other programming languages? That would be awesome?

chenzero1five wrote:

FreshTheCat wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

I'm honestly hoping they add stuff to learn more coding languages, I don't see a reason why this site should just be only teaching beginners.

So like, make tutorials on how to do certain scratch stuff in other programming languages? That would be awesome?

Yes, and also support for coding for other languages.

FreshTheCat wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

FreshTheCat wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

I'm honestly hoping they add stuff to learn more coding languages, I don't see a reason why this site should just be only teaching beginners.

So like, make tutorials on how to do certain scratch stuff in other programming languages? That would be awesome?

Yes, and also support for coding for other languages.

Im pretty sure that's been rejected (meaning that it's unlikely that it'll ever get added)

chenzero1five wrote:

FreshTheCat wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

FreshTheCat wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

I'm honestly hoping they add stuff to learn more coding languages, I don't see a reason why this site should just be only teaching beginners.

So like, make tutorials on how to do certain scratch stuff in other programming languages? That would be awesome?

Yes, and also support for coding for other languages.

Im pretty sure that's been rejected (meaning that it's unlikely that it'll ever get added)

It is, but I find the reason it being rejected dumb.

2.2 Text-based syntax in Scratch
Some users wish to code Scratch not with the blocks, but with typing code instead (similar to how more advanced programming languages work). Others are interested in an option to view, convert, or download Scratch code to other programming languages. However, the Scratch Team has discussed this possibility multiple times and has decided every time that it would not be beneficial for beginners or teachers.

This extends to coding, viewing, converting, or downloading Scratch in any text-based language, including BBCode, Javascript, some form of pseudocode, or some other programming language. If you wish to code using another language, then you can learn it on your own, but it would have to be done outside of Scratch. For those who are interested, it may be worth checking out Tosh. It is a text-based programming language that serves as a text editor for Scratch projects. Another option is MakeCode Arcade, a programming language that can convert between block-based and text-based programming within the editor. Advanced programmers can use Leopard to make Scratch projects directly using JavaScript.

FreshTheCat wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

FreshTheCat wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

FreshTheCat wrote:

chenzero1five wrote:

I'm honestly hoping they add stuff to learn more coding languages, I don't see a reason why this site should just be only teaching beginners.

So like, make tutorials on how to do certain scratch stuff in other programming languages? That would be awesome?

Yes, and also support for coding for other languages.

Im pretty sure that's been rejected (meaning that it's unlikely that it'll ever get added)

It is, but I find the reason it being rejected dumb.

2.2 Text-based syntax in Scratch
Some users wish to code Scratch not with the blocks, but with typing code instead (similar to how more advanced programming languages work). Others are interested in an option to view, convert, or download Scratch code to other programming languages. However, the Scratch Team has discussed this possibility multiple times and has decided every time that it would not be beneficial for beginners or teachers.

This extends to coding, viewing, converting, or downloading Scratch in any text-based language, including BBCode, Javascript, some form of pseudocode, or some other programming language. If you wish to code using another language, then you can learn it on your own, but it would have to be done outside of Scratch. For those who are interested, it may be worth checking out Tosh. It is a text-based programming language that serves as a text editor for Scratch projects. Another option is MakeCode Arcade, a programming language that can convert between block-based and text-based programming within the editor. Advanced programmers can use Leopard to make Scratch projects directly using JavaScript.

in other words, it wouldn't be useful for scratch's target audience and there are websites outside of scratch that can do this