Do NOT add the new Scratch Membership paywalled features.

da-ultimate-creater

king of the page

IndexErrorException wrote:
AHypnoman wrote:
IndexErrorException wrote:
I guess the question to be asked is: why would anyone purchase the subscription? If we got rid of special features for members, then why would anybody even buy it?

I believe some sort of minimal public appreciation should be shown on the profiles of those who are members.
You can give members exclusive content without effectively shaming people who aren't members.

How is that effectively shaming others? If I put my hard earned money into the platform, a tiny bit of recognition wouldn't hurt.

If I didn't buy the membership but see someone that does have it, I would think wow that's nice they support Scratch.

Other apps have recognition for paying members, why not Scratch?

I mean this platform is meant to introduce programming to children, so the little bit of recognition wouldn’t register as respect because they support Scratch, it would be taken as a motive of jealousy because they can’t get the membership. This could also lead to bullying of another child has the membership and little Timmy who can’t afford it doesn’t have the membership.

Last edited by da-ultimate-creater (Nov. 29, 2025 22:03:57)

IndexErrorException

Okay so then just report the bully?

I believe a majority of people who buy the subscription do it due to their love for what this platform brings for aspiring children. Why would they undermine that exact philosophy?

PaperMarioFan2024

IndexErrorException wrote:
Okay so then just report the bully?

I believe a majority of people who buy the subscription do it due to their love for what this platform brings for aspiring children. Why would they undermine that exact philosophy?

Perhaps, then maybe and just maybe, the ST will listen. If the whole subscription service thing goes against and undermines their own philosophy, then that means they’re violating their own rejection and that they’re hiding it for that very reason. If that’s the case then surely that’ll have to convince them to drop this whole subscription thing.
Okay now that’s just confusing.

So reporting the bully as in reporting the person? As in the person who’s bragging about having the money to afford the membership subscription service while little Timmy can’t? I can see that working but that could also cause a few problems along with it.

I mean for example, what if they already have knowledge that they’re being reported for bullying and they do something worse to the other person? What if something were to slip out and then it forced the bully to make matters worse for the other user?

Last edited by PaperMarioFan2024 (Nov. 29, 2025 22:33:08)

CaptFrIEdshrimp

Uhh… Well this might start the worst flame war ever recorded in scratch history… And maybe the internet too…

Welcome to yikesville where angry mobs happen, constantly.

CaptFrIEdshrimp

And what is dis subscription service anyway

da-ultimate-creater

CaptFrIEdshrimp wrote:
And what is dis subscription service anyway

You can read about it here.

PaperMarioFan2024

Can we get back on topic please? It’s starting to get off-topic here again.

CaptFrIEdshrimp wrote:
And what is dis subscription service anyway

CubeUpload might be down so here’s the definition for it that I found on Wikipedia. I believe Scratch Wiki doesn’t have a specific definition for the term to my knowledge.

I still believe this won’t be a good look if Scratch endorses the membership thingy imo. There’s bound to be talk about it, lots of it.

Za-Chary

PaperMarioFan2024 wrote:
So reporting the bully as in reporting the person? As in the person who’s bragging about having the money to afford the membership subscription service while little Timmy can’t? I can see that working but that could also cause a few problems along with it.

I mean for example, what if they already have knowledge that they’re being reported for bullying and they do something worse to the other person? What if something were to slip out and then it forced the bully to make matters worse for the other user?

If someone bullies another person for not having the Scratch Membership, reporting them is the right thing to do. Any problems that I can think of with reporting this user — including the one you mentioned, bolded above — are technically already “problems” with the report system. The solution? Don't ever tell someone that you are reporting them. Unless you tell someone that you're reporting them, they would never know that you are the one reporting them.

starlightsparker

I heavily agree.
Systems like this work for some sites, but in a site filled with little kids… I don't think that belongs here.
Kids will only feel bad and left out because of this.

Last edited by starlightsparker (Yesterday 03:10:58)

jmdzti_0-0

Za-Chary wrote:
PaperMarioFan2024 wrote:
So reporting the bully as in reporting the person? As in the person who’s bragging about having the money to afford the membership subscription service while little Timmy can’t? I can see that working but that could also cause a few problems along with it.

I mean for example, what if they already have knowledge that they’re being reported for bullying and they do something worse to the other person? What if something were to slip out and then it forced the bully to make matters worse for the other user?
If someone bullies another person for not having the Scratch Membership, reporting them is the right thing to do. Any problems that I can think of with reporting this user — including the one you mentioned, bolded above — are technically already “problems” with the report system. The solution? Don't ever tell someone that you are reporting them. Unless you tell someone that you're reporting them, they would never know that you are the one reporting them.

The thing is preventing harassment in the first place. Waiting for it to happen and then taking action isn’t what should happen.

Za-Chary

jmdzti_0-0 wrote:
The thing is preventing harassment in the first place. Waiting for it to happen and then taking action isn’t what should happen.

Fantastic point. Personally what I'm interested in is how much bullying will really occur as a result of the Scratch Membership. It sounds counter-intuitive to wait and see if there are any problems rather than just preventing any potential problems in the first place. At the same time, if there turns out to be no such problems, then implementing such features could be worth it. Unfortunately there's no clear way to answer this without seeing the features implemented…

One could compare by thinking about bullying with regards to existing tier-based Scratch features. Do we routinely see Scratchers bullying New Scratchers? Do we routinely see Scratchers with 10+ year accounts bullying accounts that are less than 10 years old? Do we routinely see SDS curators bullying those who are not SDS curators? I haven't seen much, myself — in what ways could the Scratch Membership be different?

kip23s

Za-Chary wrote:
jmdzti_0-0 wrote:
The thing is preventing harassment in the first place. Waiting for it to happen and then taking action isn’t what should happen.
Fantastic point. Personally what I'm interested in is how much bullying will really occur as a result of the Scratch Membership. It sounds counter-intuitive to wait and see if there are any problems rather than just preventing any potential problems in the first place. At the same time, if there turns out to be no such problems, then implementing such features could be worth it. Unfortunately there's no clear way to answer this without seeing the features implemented…

One could compare by thinking about bullying with regards to existing tier-based Scratch features. Do we routinely see Scratchers bullying New Scratchers? Do we routinely see Scratchers with 10+ year accounts bullying accounts that are less than 10 years old? Do we routinely see SDS curators bullying those who are not SDS curators? I haven't seen much, myself — in what ways could the Scratch Membership be different?

SDS curators are suppose to help the community. And the Scratcher rank is required to do everything. Nobody cares about account age, since it isn't important to people. However the cat avatar frame will cause bragging rights.

Za-Chary

kip23s wrote:
SDS curators are suppose to help the community.

Yes, they are. My point is that, in theory, an SDS curator could use their additional permissions (curating for an official Scratch Team studio, having a private forum, etc.) as leverage for bragging rights. However, I don't believe that they are actually bullying others over this. So, how do we know that the cat avatar frame will cause bragging/bullying?

CoolLock

Za-Chary wrote:
One could compare by thinking about bullying with regards to existing tier-based Scratch features. Do we routinely see Scratchers bullying New Scratchers? Do we routinely see Scratchers with 10+ year accounts bullying accounts that are less than 10 years old? Do we routinely see SDS curators bullying those who are not SDS curators? I haven't seen much, myself — in what ways could the Scratch Membership be different?

Getting promoted to a Scratcher is relatively easy.
If you become an SDS curator, doesn't that mean the ST trust you because of your good actions? That kind of person wouldn't bully someone for not being an SDS curator.
None of your examples give perks (except debatably the Scratcher role), and none of them require the one important thing: money.

kip23s

CoolLock wrote:
Za-Chary wrote:
One could compare by thinking about bullying with regards to existing tier-based Scratch features. Do we routinely see Scratchers bullying New Scratchers? Do we routinely see Scratchers with 10+ year accounts bullying accounts that are less than 10 years old? Do we routinely see SDS curators bullying those who are not SDS curators? I haven't seen much, myself — in what ways could the Scratch Membership be different?
Getting promoted to a Scratcher is relatively easy.
If you become an SDS curator, doesn't that mean the ST trust you because of your good actions? That kind of person wouldn't bully someone for not being an SDS curator.
None of your examples give perks (except debatably the Scratcher role), and none of them require the one important thing: money.

Took the mouth out of my words on the last one

starlightsparker

Za-Chary wrote:
kip23s wrote:
SDS curators are suppose to help the community.
Yes, they are. My point is that, in theory, an SDS curator could use their additional permissions (curating for an official Scratch Team studio, having a private forum, etc.) as leverage for bragging rights. However, I don't believe that they are actually bullying others over this. So, how do we know that the cat avatar frame will cause bragging/bullying?

Most SDS curators are users that ST trusts to an extent, like people who have worked with ST or official studios before, etc.
These kinds of people are typically not the type to bully others on Scratch, though it's possible, it's unlikely and I don't recall this ever happening.
Avatar frames, however, can be bought by anyone who can afford it including people who would bully others over it.
Also, being a Scratcher is different than this just because almost every active new Scratch user will become a Scratcher eventually, the means to become one are free and available to everybody, unlike paywalls.

jmdzti_0-0

Za-Chary wrote:
Fantastic point. Personally what I'm interested in is how much bullying will really occur as a result of the Scratch Membership. It sounds counter-intuitive to wait and see if there are any problems rather than just preventing any potential problems in the first place. At the same time, if there turns out to be no such problems, then implementing such features could be worth it. Unfortunately there's no clear way to answer this without seeing the features implemented…

One could compare by thinking about bullying with regards to existing tier-based Scratch features. Do we routinely see Scratchers bullying New Scratchers? Do we routinely see Scratchers with 10+ year accounts bullying accounts that are less than 10 years old? Do we routinely see SDS curators bullying those who are not SDS curators? I haven't seen much, myself — in what ways could the Scratch Membership be different?

We don’t have more Scratch ranks for the same reason. Even if it’s a little amount, it’s bound to happen, and just becuase it’s a “rare case” doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be taken preventive action against.

Plus, as @starlightsparker mentioned, SDS curators are people the team trust in. That, compared to the nowadays entitled kids with more affluent families which, from my own experience are not very rare to see, can make that comparison somewhat unbalanced. Keep in mind this platform is meant for children, so maturity is the least I would expect here.

Additionally, the term bullying is a bit harmful in this case, since it fundamentally differs from harassment and just hate. It just makes the latter ones look less important or even invalid.

solomonw2440

Rosics wrote:
I have a feeling this backlash will be worse than the color change in 2023..

mingo-gag wrote:
Ok then how are they going to Justify that $35 Price or $150 for Lifetime

Also Like to bring up the Outsider thing which has more features than the Membership.
Umm, other things OFF of Scratch?

Oh and yeah, Cat Blocks will also be a part of this subscription. So they couldn't bring it back for April Fools but for a MEMBERSHIP?

The catblocks being membership-only absolutely destroyed the goodwill i had for the scratch team, like “we couldn't bring it back for april fools” is such a blatant lie and this proves it.
it's not about catblocks btw, it's about honesty and integrity. i couldn't care less about catblocks but the fact they'd lie through their teeth and disappoint a lot of the userbase just to bring it back in an already negatively-received subscription is baffling and kind of offends me.

pippy2011eight

solomonw2440 wrote:
Rosics wrote:
I have a feeling this backlash will be worse than the color change in 2023..

mingo-gag wrote:
Ok then how are they going to Justify that $35 Price or $150 for Lifetime

Also Like to bring up the Outsider thing which has more features than the Membership.
Umm, other things OFF of Scratch?

Oh and yeah, Cat Blocks will also be a part of this subscription. So they couldn't bring it back for April Fools but for a MEMBERSHIP?
The catblocks being membership-only absolutely destroyed the goodwill i had for the scratch team, like “we couldn't bring it back for april fools” is such a blatant lie and this proves it.
it's not about catblocks btw, it's about honesty and integrity. i couldn't care less about catblocks but the fact they'd lie through their teeth and disappoint a lot of the userbase just to bring it back in an already negatively-received subscription is baffling and kind of offends me.

for me, it's about cat blocks, if they remove cat blocks from the membership, or add it to the whole site, then I won't care about the membership anymore.

NanoRook

I thought about it for a bit and realized that, on top of the existing problems people have mentioned with the membership program (some I agree with, others I don't), Scratch hasn't really innovated or done anything in the last 5-10 years to justify asking directly for money from its userbase. When I buy a membership to a service–an MMO, a streaming library, whatever–I am saying that I like their content and would like to support their business, possibly in hopes of getting more content.

Meanwhile, between the start of the 2.0 era and the silent announcement of the membership program, Scratch has removed:

The front page's user-curated projects tab
The discuss tab
What The Community Is Loving
What The Community Is Remixing
Recently Shared Projects
Good cloud variables
10+ years of cloud variable history (I had data going all the way back to 2014 that was just erased in an instant)
The ability to have more than 25 replies under a studio comment
The ability to do anything interesting with studios, really
The ability to share functional code snippets and personal websites, killing a lot of the old advanced community that used to congregate here
The remix tree
The ability to backpack forum scripts

Probably other stuff I'm forgetting. Basically the Scratch membership is saying “If you pay us, we'll give you fun, optional bonuses for your account” on a website where fun, optional bonuses are being nerfed or removed all the time. They're making millions year over year and yet each year the average Scratch user has less and looks forward to less. What exactly am I helping to fund here? The outreach programs? Those are nice and I've actually participated in a few at local schools and stuff but I don't see the benefit as a regular user of Scratch.

Last edited by NanoRook (Today 02:48:56)

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