Listen up, Scratch team - you guys have got to add an AI related extension into Scratch. I know you can do it, because you've already done it, in the form of Text to Speech, and the new Face Sensing extension. You should add a basic AI chatting extension on Scratch. I mean, you claim you want us to be creative - think of how much creativity this extension would generate!!! We could make AI chatbots, AI assistants, and we could even harness the true power of AI to make more advanced things, like image generators! There's literally no reason to not add this, so yeah, you should do it.

AI Image generation in Scratch is rejected.

TOLORS wrote:

2.10 AI image generation in Scratch
The Scratch Team has experimented with AI image generation for Scratch in the past. There are benefits for enhancing creativity, including making it easier for Scratchers to make the costumes they want for their projects, as well as inspiring Scratchers to make new stories based on the images they generate. However, there are also many downsides, including ethical concerns arising from AI images using copyrighted material, biases present in AI which reinforce harmful stereotypes, the ease of creating inappropriate content, and the difficulty of accessing AI. For these reasons, the Scratch Team has stated that they will not be adding AI image generation to Scratch anytime soon. For more information, see this article.

However, the use of AI as a virtual assistant is NOT rejected. You can discuss it on this topic. In general, AI in Scratch is not entirely rejected; it depends on the specific use of the AI.

Also, note that the use of AI images in Scratch projects is allowed; for more information, see #3.7 on this list.

An AI Assistant is already coming to Scratch, by the way.
And there are a lot of legal, ethical, and creative concerns based on what and how AI is used.

DarthVader4Life wrote:

AI Image generation in Scratch is rejected.

TOLORS wrote:

2.10 AI image generation in Scratch
The Scratch Team has experimented with AI image generation for Scratch in the past. There are benefits for enhancing creativity, including making it easier for Scratchers to make the costumes they want for their projects, as well as inspiring Scratchers to make new stories based on the images they generate. However, there are also many downsides, including ethical concerns arising from AI images using copyrighted material, biases present in AI which reinforce harmful stereotypes, the ease of creating inappropriate content, and the difficulty of accessing AI. For these reasons, the Scratch Team has stated that they will not be adding AI image generation to Scratch anytime soon. For more information, see this article.

However, the use of AI as a virtual assistant is NOT rejected. You can discuss it on this topic. In general, AI in Scratch is not entirely rejected; it depends on the specific use of the AI.

Also, note that the use of AI images in Scratch projects is allowed; for more information, see #3.7 on this list.

An AI Assistant is already coming to Scratch, by the way.
And there are a lot of legal, ethical, and creative concerns based on what and how AI is used.

How are there legal, ethical, and creative concerns based on what and how AI is used? It's literally the only thing anyone needs to make any digital project. And are you saying that it's illegal to make an AI image generator in Scratch!?

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

How are there legal, ethical, and creative concerns based on what and how AI is used? It's literally the only thing anyone needs to make any digital project. And are you saying that it's illegal to make an AI image generator in Scratch!?

Legal concerns: What if the AI generates something that is a copyrighted thing? The Scratch Team could get in some trouble
Ethical: AI uses other pictures and art to create its own art. Therefore there is an ethical problem through some people believing that AI steals art.
Creative: Ai Art is seen as low effort art, and a mark of laziness.

For the second question, one hasn't been made yet, so that bridge would have to be crossed when it is reached.

If you read the rejection, you will see that using AI images is allowed, but Scratch will not add a way to generate images in the editor.
The legal and ethical concerns come from what data is used to train the AI and/or if the AI is used to make something illegal. There's also the matter of disclosing if and how heavily AI was used. The creative concerns come in when you rely on AI to get you through the creative process. Need a writing prompt? That's perfectly fine. But when you use AI to generate an entire book, it removes you from the process of writing that book and it prevents your voice from being in that book.

Also, the fact that this tool is all that is needed to completely generate a product or service is very alarming and is part of the problem. That is, it is easier to abuse one tool that can do it all than it is to abuse multiple tools that can only do specific things.

DarthVader4Life wrote:

If you read the rejection, you will see that using AI images is allowed, but Scratch will not add a way to generate images in the editor.
The legal and ethical concerns come from what data is used to train the AI and/or if the AI is used to make something illegal. There's also the matter of disclosing if and how heavily AI was used. The creative concerns come in when you rely on AI to get you through the creative process. Need a writing prompt? That's perfectly fine. But when you use AI to generate an entire book, it removes you from the process of writing that book and it prevents your voice from being in that book.

Also, the fact that this tool is all that is needed to completely generate a product or service is very alarming and is part of the problem. That is, it is easier to abuse one tool that can do it all than it is to abuse multiple tools that can only do specific things.

There's nothing stopping a creative, really smart Scratcher (like myself) from designing an AI image generator. And the Scratch team can just censor projects that use AI illegally.
AI is our future, and it deserves to have a dedicated extension in Scratch.

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

DarthVader4Life wrote:

-snip-

There's nothing stopping a creative, really smart Scratcher (like myself) from designing an AI image generator. And the Scratch team can just censor projects that use AI illegally.
AI is our future, and it deserves to have a dedicated extension in Scratch.

You really want AI to take over people's jobs, and not to mention, it's supposed to be a tool

Ai music steals other works
AI art is lazy in my opinion, just use your hands and draw a stick figure
AI is supposed to be an assistance to help not take over

mingo-gag wrote:

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

DarthVader4Life wrote:

-snip-

There's nothing stopping a creative, really smart Scratcher (like myself) from designing an AI image generator. And the Scratch team can just censor projects that use AI illegally.
AI is our future, and it deserves to have a dedicated extension in Scratch.

You really want AI to take over people's jobs, and not to mention, it's supposed to be a tool

I never said I wanted it to dominate the humans. And it is a tool - a super powerful, limitless, and overall legendary tool!

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

mingo-gag wrote:

You really want AI to take over people's jobs, and not to mention, it's supposed to be a tool

I never said I wanted it to dominate the humans. And it is a tool - a super powerful, limitless, and overall legendary tool!

It is a powerful and useful tool, with the capability of being abused to produce poor quality products for little effort, which is a lot of what we've been seeing of it lately.

DarthVader4Life wrote:

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

mingo-gag wrote:

You really want AI to take over people's jobs, and not to mention, it's supposed to be a tool

I never said I wanted it to dominate the humans. And it is a tool - a super powerful, limitless, and overall legendary tool!

It is a powerful and useful tool, with the capability of being abused to produce poor quality products for little effort, which is a lot of what we've been seeing of it lately.

So, the ST can just block/censor projects that misuse AI. Simple as that.

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

So, the ST can just block/censor projects that misuse AI. Simple as that.

That's easier said than done.

Besides, we already know an AI assistant is coming (the “Creative Learning Assistant”). The Scratch Team has made it clear that what they're working on is only intended to be an optional guidance feature; it's not supposed to be able to lead to any of the ethical/moral/legal issues mentioned above.

no support, all creativity would be lost,

Novody read that it would be a chatbot extention

pippy2011eight wrote:

no support, all creativity would be lost,

Actually, it'll do the exact opposite of that. There are tons of AI platforms that web developers and business owners use to help them with their projects & manage work flow, so why can't Scratch be one of those platforms!?

(removed by moderator - please keep it polite)

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

pippy2011eight wrote:

no support, all creativity would be lost,

Actually, it'll do the exact opposite of that. There are tons of AI platforms that web developers and business owners use to help them with their projects & manage work flow, so why can't Scratch be one of those platforms!?

well, the majority of scratch are little kids, and they might not want to actually put the time and effort into making a fully fledged project, so they would just use the AI to do everything for them instead. The CLA coming up will suggest and give some ideas, but it won't do things FOR you.

The actual suggestion here isn't very clear. Are you asking for a chatbot extension(i.e. a reporter block that sends a message to an AI and gets a response)? If so, no support. “No reason not to add this” well uh yeah about that. To start off, I'm not anti-AI, it's just the fact of how it's starting to become more and more involved in our everyday lives kind of sucks. Scratch of all things defintely doesn't need anything like this. The more humans rely on AI, the less people actually know how to do. It takes away creativity. It's just a computer program. It makes people lazy. I've seen people who were perfectly talented move to using AI just because it's easier. It's ruined a lot of things. Also, if people want to talk to AI??? They can just??? Go to an AI website??? That's what they exist for. Also, AI costs a lot of money. Like, a LOT of money. And takes a LOT of people to keep it up. Did we not go over this in the previous suggestion you had(trending searches, I believe)??? Pretty sure we discussed this. Like a lot. It's also terrible for the environment, do you know how much water it uses up? And don't forget that scratch is already low on money. If everything else wasn't enough, they had to add the scratch membership just so they can keep the servers up. In other words, Scratch doesn't have the money or employees to keep something like this up.

lfg30700 wrote:

The actual suggestion here isn't very clear. Are you asking for a chatbot extension(i.e. a reporter block that sends a message to an AI and gets a response)? If so, no support. “No reason not to add this” well uh yeah about that. To start off, I'm not anti-AI, it's just the fact of how it's starting to become more and more involved in our everyday lives kind of sucks. Scratch of all things defintely doesn't need anything like this. The more humans rely on AI, the less people actually know how to do. It takes away creativity. It's just a computer program. It makes people lazy. I've seen people who were perfectly talented move to using AI just because it's easier. It's ruined a lot of things. Also, if people want to talk to AI??? They can just??? Go to an AI website??? That's what they exist for. Also, AI costs a lot of money. Like, a LOT of money. And takes a LOT of people to keep it up. Did we not go over this in the previous suggestion you had(trending searches, I believe)??? Pretty sure we discussed this. Like a lot. It's also terrible for the environment, do you know how much water it uses up? And don't forget that scratch is already low on money. If everything else wasn't enough, they had to add the scratch membership just so they can keep the servers up. In other words, Scratch doesn't have the money or employees to keep something like this up.

Oh no, here we go again.
How does AI becoming part of our daily lives suck? AI is the future of everything, and it'll make all our lives a lot easier. So, Scratch of all things actually DOES need anything like this, for the sake of the future of humanity. And AI doesn't suck the creativity out of anything; in fact, in this case, it might inspire advanced Scratchers to code legendary projects that involve AI! How the heck is that taking away creativity? It's literally enhancing creativity. And not everyone has to use AI; “perfectly talented” people can just keep doing what they do, because AI is optional. Also, if people want to talk to AI??? They can just??? Use the AI extension to make a chatbot in Scratch??? That's what it would exist for. And why would AI cost money? Scratchers have made monofunctional AI's in their own projects before, including myself, and how much money does it take for them to keep it up? A grand total of zero dollars!!! So yeah, depending on what the AI is for, it generally doesn't cost anything. And how does AI use up water??? Machines and water don't mix!!! And there's a lack of evidence that Scratch is low on money, so you can't say that they're low on money with absolute certainty. In other words, Scratch 100% DOES have the money AND employees to keep something like this up! Ha ha ha, let's see how you respond to this masterpiece of a post!!!

I don’t think im gonna comment much here because it looks like this is starting to become very flame war-y but to state my opinion on the whole “ai is our future” thing, the whole point of scratch is to imagine, program, share, and adding ai would eliminate the values i underlined and make people too reliant on ai, which can become dangerous as it may ruin their thinking and creativity. And also, scratch sure has a lot of money, but they need to save it and not spend it on AI. just because they have a lot of money doesnt mean they can use it all on expensive stuff, as it can then go to running costs and may cause problems in the future. Also, AI does use water, as although machines and water dont mix, water CAN be used to cool machines, so AI does use a lot of water to cool the systems. Also, the reason why users are able to create ai is because they are relying on free software to make it, and ai isnt always free (look it up)

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

Oh no, here we go again.

How ironic, this was my exact reaction when I saw this topic.

How does AI becoming part of our daily lives suck? AI is the future of everything, and it'll make all our lives a lot easier.

Because AI as it stands is a thoughtless leech on creativity and the essence of human spirit. Yes it will make people's lives easier, but if you never have to do anything yourself, you never actually learn anything, and when you DON'T have access to AI, or it starts giving you the wrong information, you're in a pickle, aren't you?

So, Scratch of all things actually DOES need anything like this, for the sake of the future of humanity.

So what you're saying here is that because AI exists and it can make people's lives easier that means it has to be in Scratch? Banks exist, they make people's lives easier by being able to take out loans and things, should we have a Scratch Bank? A Scratch Grocery Store?

And AI doesn't suck the creativity out of anything; in fact, in this case, it might inspire advanced Scratchers to code legendary projects that involve AI!

Yes, there are ways to use AI for good, but AI is quite literally a leech on creativity. It takes everything it can find from everything on the internet in its training data that it stole from creative individuals, and spits out a response. When used it the right contexts it can work but it's not worth it for all the other problems.

How the heck is that taking away creativity? It's literally enhancing creativity. And not everyone has to use AI; “perfectly talented” people can just keep doing what they do, because AI is optional.

That's the thing. If an easier alternative exists, people are beckoned to use it, are they not? I've seen plenty of people who have resisted AI too but it also doesn't help that people everywhere are pushing AI into everything.

Also, if people want to talk to AI??? They can just??? Use the AI extension to make a chatbot in Scratch??? That's what it would exist for.

But why would they do that if they could just go to the website and use the AI there? I don't think you understand that most people who are using AI are too lazy to do whatever they're doing themselves, they're certainly not going to make a chatbot themseleves when they can just speak to AI a lot easier by just going to the site.

And why would AI cost money? Scratchers have made monofunctional AI's in their own projects before, including myself, and how much money does it take for them to keep it up? A grand total of zero dollars!!!

“Ah yes I don't pay for the server costs of this website so it must not cost anything” no. That's not how this works. Just because YOU aren't paying for it doesn't mean it's not a problem, and a big one at that. Keeping projects up in general costs the ST money, because they have to pay for the servers. An entire AI? That'd be a GIGANTIC server cost.

So yeah, depending on what the AI is for, it generally doesn't cost anything.

Again. Everything costs something. Nothing is free.

And how does AI use up water??? Machines and water don't mix!!!

It's used to cool the servers so they don't explode and burst into flames from the amount of data they're having to send out and recieve. It uses billions of gallons a year.

And there's a lack of evidence that Scratch is low on money, so you can't say that they're low on money with absolute certainty.

Uh. For one, the fact the servers go down sometimes, like how the cloud variable servers were for like ever, two the fact they had to change the way cloud variables work in order to keep them running. Three, how in the scratch membership announcement post they specificically describe how they need more money to support the servers because donations are unstable and lately haven't been enough. There's plenty of evidence.

In other words, Scratch 100% DOES have the money AND employees to keep something like this up!

You didn't mention employees once. We went over this in the other topic, OpenAI has about 6,400 employees. Scratch does not have NEARLY as many. And they clearly don't have the money, either.

Ha ha ha, let's see how you respond to this masterpiece of a post!!!

Okay. This is how I respond.

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

lfg30700 wrote:

snip

Oh no, here we go again.
How does AI becoming part of our daily lives suck? AI is the future of everything, and it'll make all our lives a lot easier.

Yes, but not generative ai, ai should be doing jobs people don't want to do, like manual labour, not art and writing.

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

So, Scratch of all things actually DOES need anything like this, for the sake of the future of humanity.

Scratch implementing something is not “for the sake of the future of humanity,” and it doesn't “need” ai, it's just something you want.

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

And AI doesn't suck the creativity out of anything; in fact, in this case, it might inspire advanced Scratchers to code legendary projects that involve AI! How the heck is that taking away creativity? It's literally enhancing creativity.

Yes some crazy projects could be made with ai, but is it really worth the ocean of slop that will come with it?

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

And not everyone has to use AI; “perfectly talented” people can just keep doing what they do, because AI is optional.

Using ai in your own projects may be optional, but you can't control the explore page and what other people do with it.

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

Also, if people want to talk to AI??? They can just??? Use the AI extension to make a chatbot in Scratch??? That's what it would exist for.

If it's only useful for one thing, why add it? People can talk to ai on other platforms.

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

And why would AI cost money? Scratchers have made monofunctional AI's in their own projects before, including myself, and how much money does it take for them to keep it up? A grand total of zero dollars!!!

Yes, but that is incredibly simple ai, which is not what you're suggesting, also, you don't know what scratch's servers cost (to store said projects and cloud vars etc, they are paying for you)

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

So yeah, depending on what the AI is for, it generally doesn't cost anything. And how does AI use up water??? Machines and water don't mix!!!

Do your research for this one. Think about machine cooling.

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

And there's a lack of evidence that Scratch is low on money, so you can't say that they're low on money with absolute certainty. In other words, Scratch 100% DOES have the money AND employees to keep something like this up!

They literally introduced the scratch membership because they don't make that much from donations.
Fun fact: OpenAI (the creators of ChatGPT) actually make less money than it costs them to upkeep their ai (search it up, it's true)

Dakota_The_Coder wrote:

Ha ha ha, let's see how you respond to this masterpiece of a post!!!

0/10, ragebait. (respectfully)

Another big issue with ai is the ethical concern of scraping hundreds of thousands of websites for data to train the ai on without paying or giving any credit to the people who made it, which completely goes against scratch's values.

Also, please clarify if you want them to add an extension to create projects containing ai, or an ai that helps to make projects.

Edit: Got beaten to it lol