Will 4.0 be coming soon? (READ THE OP Please)

ThisIsTemp1

Please read the entire post

I found this pdf which I think describes a job in Scratch. In the second paragraph it says that Scratch will be developing 4.0 starting in 2025. Is this true?

alpha_ape_13

Well if you could get there from the jobs link then yes it's real

jvvg

My assumption would be that they are starting the development of 4.0 soon based on that, but bear in mind that doesn't mean it will be finished any time soon. Also bear in mind that version numbers are somewhat arbitrary. Major changes could happen under a system still called 3.0, or they could make more minor changes and choose to call it 4.0.

Scratch137

jvvg wrote:
(#3)
Also bear in mind that version numbers are somewhat arbitrary. Major changes could happen under a system still called 3.0, or they could make more minor changes and choose to call it 4.0.

While this is true, the fact that they are preemptively using the name “Scratch 4.0” for an update they haven't even started developing yet strongly suggests that it is to be a major update with new features.

The job posting says that Scratch 4.0 will feature “a re-imagined online community and creative AI,” which certainly sounds like a big jump.

If they were planning to just push a minor update and call it Scratch 4.0, it wouldn't really make sense for them to announce it this far in advance—especially since it's quite well established by now that a new version number means a major update.

Last edited by Scratch137 (Nov. 4, 2024 23:19:28)

mali3000

this is pretty strange because scratch has stated many times before that there wont be a scratch 4.0 for a while and they arent really planning on doing anything with that, but here it is? i would like to hear what the scratch team has to add on to this

BigNate469

mali3000 wrote:
this is pretty strange because scratch has stated many times before that there wont be a scratch 4.0 for a while and they arent really planning on doing anything with that, but here it is? i would like to hear what the scratch team has to add on to this

Considering that they said that (very) quietly, I'm not certain they started planning it until very recently.

blubby4

It makes you wonder what kind of “creative AI” they're planning. They've said that image generation AI is rejected, so presumably it's some kind of chatbot?? [/speculation]

TheAutocorrectingCat

-deleted, I was wrong-

Last edited by TheAutocorrectingCat (Nov. 5, 2024 02:50:25)

jvvg

Scratch137 wrote:
jvvg wrote:
(#3)
Also bear in mind that version numbers are somewhat arbitrary. Major changes could happen under a system still called 3.0, or they could make more minor changes and choose to call it 4.0.
While this is true, the fact that they are preemptively using the name “Scratch 4.0” for an update they haven't even started developing yet strongly suggests that it is to be a major update with new features.

My point is that we shouldn't speculate too much. Very little information is actually available, but I am seeing a lot of conclusions being jumped to.

Scratch_Cat_Coder8

jvvg wrote:
Scratch137 wrote:
jvvg wrote:
(#3)
Also bear in mind that version numbers are somewhat arbitrary. Major changes could happen under a system still called 3.0, or they could make more minor changes and choose to call it 4.0.
While this is true, the fact that they are preemptively using the name “Scratch 4.0” for an update they haven't even started developing yet strongly suggests that it is to be a major update with new features.
My point is that we shouldn't speculate too much. Very little information is actually available, but I am seeing a lot of conclusions being jumped to.

@Paddle2See DID actually comment about the AI feature in the PDF in a now closed topic and it seemed like he was talking more about the AI than if the 4.0 was true or not. I might be miss-interpreting it though.

Scratch137

Scratch_Cat_Coder8 wrote:
(#10)
jvvg wrote:
Scratch137 wrote:
jvvg wrote:
(#3)
Also bear in mind that version numbers are somewhat arbitrary. Major changes could happen under a system still called 3.0, or they could make more minor changes and choose to call it 4.0.
While this is true, the fact that they are preemptively using the name “Scratch 4.0” for an update they haven't even started developing yet strongly suggests that it is to be a major update with new features.
My point is that we shouldn't speculate too much. Very little information is actually available, but I am seeing a lot of conclusions being jumped to.
@Paddle2See DID actually comment about the AI feature in the PDF in a now closed topic and it seemed like he was talking more about the AI than if the 4.0 was true or not. I might be miss-interpreting it though.

Would this be it?

jvvg

Scratch_Cat_Coder8 wrote:
@Paddle2See DID actually comment about the AI feature in the PDF in a now closed topic and it seemed like he was talking more about the AI than if the 4.0 was true or not. I might be miss-interpreting it though.

From the PDF, all the new information I can really gather that I can say confidently is that there are plans to build a Scratch 4.0, there will be significant changes to how the community works, and Scratch 4.0 it will involve AI in some form.

Beyond that, I really can't say much more. It's not clear what the AI will actually be for, whether it be for script assistance, coming up with project ideas, answering questions, or something else. I also don't see any indications as to what the actual community changes will be. It's also not entirely clear if Scratch 4.0 will primarily be focused on the editor or the community (or a combination of the two), and if it will be a complete ground-up rebuild or a set of incremental changes.

(Side note: I actually considered applying for the job since I have several years of experience as a backend engineer, but ultimately opted not to)

Dagriffpatchfan

I can't read the pdf - my kindle refuses to download pdfs

can someone put the text here?

gem1001

Given that Scratch 2.0 took 5 years to come out, and 3.0 took 3, we could expect a release around 2028-2030.

CodersAreGoingOnHere

I had a dream of 4.0 lol

i_eat_coffee

gem1001 wrote:
Given that Scratch 2.0 took 5 years to come out, and 3.0 took 3, we could expect a release around 2028-2030.

Let's not forget that they are apparently trying to add AI tools into the website too. It's unclear what–maybe a chatbot, maybe AI costume generation, maybe even AI text generation extension; we don't know, but the point is, that's probably going to take longer.

marsmark

based on the suggested experience and position, I think its most likely be prioritized in maintaining stable websites before anything. scratch 3.0 has been in some sort of mess right now, especially the servers, I think its only right to fix the current issue so that ST can focus on actually adding stuff.

jvvg

gem1001 wrote:
Given that Scratch 2.0 took 5 years to come out, and 3.0 took 3, we could expect a release around 2028-2030.

That's not really a great methodology to use. A lot of different factors influence how long a software development project takes. For example if Scratch 4.0 is intended to be a more incremental change rather than a full ground-up rebuild it could come out quite a bit faster. On the other hand if it's a full rebuild with a ton of new features it will probably take much longer. Similarly, the amount and quality of developers they have (and how much they have on their plates maintaining the existing site) will make a big difference.

ametrine_

romskibiidi wrote:
Where did you find this PDF?

https://www.scratchfoundation.org/careers

DifferentDance8

Based on the fact that they now added a sprite deletion confirmation and 3.0 scratchblocks, I think the community side of it is getting closer and closer every day.

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